Codex of Power Revamp

There has always been a huge disconnect between what people on the forums say, and between what goes on in game. Codex were meant to be the "end-all, be-all", but that is most obviously not the case. Charms were meant as the ultimate plat sink, and while they are still that, they are a self-fulfilling prophecy. People grind xp for codex/tomes, and farm cash (leech xp, no cash) so they can complete these things. And in the process, these "extras" became the requirement. But the game has been this way so long, and I am not sure how we could go about removing these "barriers to progress".
And sorry detroit, no idea which of the usual 6 or 7 LFG beastlords you might be, but it always seemed to me that bst is always wanted for raids, but good luck finding xp groups outside your guild. Usually it seems there is a lack of tanks or healers LFG to get groups going these days. Feel free to look for me when online though.

Andari
 
People keeping telling me charms and tomes don't matter but leach xp groups are the only groups I ever really find and they only want my Beastlord and you all know leachers don't see loot/split. Nobody replies when I send tells for any other kind of xp group.

If you want to group... start the group yourself. Buy maps and start a map group. People always looking for loot or quest pieces from them. Go to places where people are and ask to join. Eventually you will get aquainted with people and make friends maybe even find a guild.

I'm pretty anti-social, average skilled at best, and have been known to ninja AFK for work, as well as fall asleep at the keyboard at night. (I'm old... give me a break) But I still managed to make some friends here and there and progress my character. If I can do it, so can you.
 
"do you think it's just going to flow into you like plankton into a whale's fucking mouth?"
 
LOL Cian just rollin in here making sense again on another thread, this guy.

Side note I would like phats and platinums to flow in to me like plankton into a whale's mouth.
 
Current Plan:

First, we have already added tomes drops throughout the old world exp areas. This should make tomes a bit easier to get, as well as make the older exp areas more lucrative. This is a separate change that is going to be included in a relatively big upcoming patch, but I figured it should be mentioned here since tome availability will matter after the CoPower change.

We are planning to get rid of CoPower completely. We will reimburse ALL experience that every player has put into the CoPower. This will most likely be done with experience potions that a player will be able to claim after the change.

The 20% power increase currently in the CoPower will then be gained through gaining experience into tomes in general. Basically, as you put experience into any set of tomes your character will not only gain the tome benefits, but also will gain an increasing percentage modifier to their damage and healing. The amount of tome experience needed to get 20% dmg/healing will be less than what was demanded by the Codexes of Power. This means that anyone who had experience in the Codexes of Power can simply dump the reimbursed exp back into the tomes of their choosing and have suffered no loss from the change.

After over a year of discussion, I think that this plan is both fair and narrowly tailored. Still, there is no way to make everyone happy in big game changes like this.

Constructive thoughts/comments/criticisms are welcome below.
 
I think this sounds alright and is a good compromise. I'd like a few questions answerd tho... is this based on completed tomes? or the ammount of expirience gained into tomes? ie can you half finish a bunch of tomes and still be getting 'CoPower exp'. And since an old CoP was about 120 AA's of exp, if a player completed 2 60-AA tomes, would that be about 4% increase as before?
 
Will there be some way to view that I have said bonuses and that it won't be just some invisible modifier that is said to be there? I like that safety net where I can see my bonuses :)
Also the exp return, say I use the exp pot on the tome and it completes, will it stop pouring in the exp after completing or will the exp overflow and be lost?
 
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Yeah as long as the reimbursement method makes it so that none of the exp is wasted/lost this sounds like a good plan.
 
Current Plan:

First, we have already added tomes drops throughout the old world exp areas. This should make tomes a bit easier to get, as well as make the older exp areas more lucrative. This is a separate change that is going to be included in a relatively big upcoming patch, but I figured it should be mentioned here since tome availability will matter after the CoPower change.

...

The 20% power increase currently in the CoPower will then be gained through gaining experience into tomes in general.

In regards to the highlighted portion (my emphasis), is it possible to make the remaining unimplemented class tomes exp-able (I don't think they are currently) but do nothing other than soak that exp and contribute to the new CoP change? Just curious. I am not sure of how difficult that is to do.

Edit: Unless it is a rather easy thing to make happen, it is probably not worth doing considering other changes and it being a small amount of exp since there are other tomes to do instead. Not to mention it will not be useful once said tomes are actually implemented. The only real benefit, I suppose, is if people acquire these tomes ahead of other tomes and decide to do them instead to prepare for their implementation while gaining the CoP bonus at the same time.
 
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Will there be some way to view that I have said bonuses and that it won't be just some invisible modifier that is said to be there? I like that safety net where I can see my bonuses :)

From a player perspective, I think it is super important to have the bonus be visible while earning it. If you are working toward a goal but not seeing progress, discouragement is fairly rapid. My assumption is that this change is being made to cut some of the uphill battle for new 65s, so as I said, visibility is important. (Even if it is just in /cm stats).

Couple of questions:
1. I assume XP will be reimbursed for half completed CoP too. Is this correct?
2. While it is small potatoes, what about the cash spent on CoPs. Will platinum be reimbursed too? Some of us may find it a bit costly to move to the new system without reimbursement.
3. Is it possible to be a little more specific on tomes dropping from old world content?
4. Will all tomes count for this (including old world, archetype, glyphs), or just the general and class tomes?
 
Not sure if the developers who would do this CoP re-work are the same as the 2.5 developers... If they aren't, my comment is irrelevant, but if they are the same developers, I don't see the point in undertaking a big development project which would delay the 2.5 release even more. Imo, the 2.5 release would be so much better for the game overall.
 
What about those players who have no tomes left to do? Would they just automatically receive the 20% bonus to their healing and damage output? And for players who have already completed their CoP's, would they just receive it off the bat or would they have to gradually re-earn it through exping other tomes?

Sorry if this is glaringly obvious I'm just really sick and have the brain capacity of a 5 year old atm
 
I would hope all exp will be reimbursed even for half Codex' and no way of losing exp through potions filling up a new tome and being lost in the empty space. That's one concern.

My second is when we move over to the new tome/ situation. The lack of tomes and rising rates. My suggestion for this is an NPC that gives you a token or flag for how many CoP you have and an NPC that will give you no drop tomes of the new system. Max possibility of only 5 no drop tomes. So people have something to put reimbursed exp into without inflating the market and causing an immediate tome shortage and without putting cash back into the market if you did cash reimbursement.

And 2.5 work is being done I'm sure. A good way to help with that is go sign up for Beta testing and go find bugs they can fix. The more they find and fix before release is more you may not have to deal with during release.
 
Neat, I must say this seems like the best solution to the perceived wall of CoPs, as the wall is removed and it's more like a slope. But, I imagine there will be more posts in S&R about opuses because I think qiute a few t8 and above people will run or almost run out of droppable tomes.
 
so you're saying... i don't get to show my hot cop 5 on fomelo? :'( but really i think this is a good change, agree with it completely, but what got me more excited was the tome drops into old area zones. i love the old world exp zones and adding tome drops will make them even better $
 
I think this sounds alright and is a good compromise. I'd like a few questions answerd tho... is this based on completed tomes? or the ammount of expirience gained into tomes? ie can you half finish a bunch of tomes and still be getting 'CoPower exp'. And since an old CoP was about 120 AA's of exp, if a player completed 2 60-AA tomes, would that be about 4% increase as before?

Amount of experience into tomes. This is to avoid problems that might occur because some tomes require more exp than others.

Will there be some way to view that I have said bonuses and that it won't be just some invisible modifier that is said to be there? I like that safety net where I can see my bonuses :)
Also the exp return, say I use the exp pot on the tome and it completes, will it stop pouring in the exp after completing or will the exp overflow and be lost?

Yes. Currently I am thinking a message in game whenever you get a full %, as well as the exact bonus being displayed on fomelo.

The potions will be in increments small enough to allow you to be relatively precise in where the experience goes. We will likely give everyone a small bonus, round everyone up to the nearest 50,000 experience, and then give them their experience back in 50,000 chunks that they can put wherever they want. Unless the player just goes on a potion clicking rampage without checking to see if their tome is already full, experience losses should be minimal. It is not perfect, but it is the best we can do given the logistics we have, and should more than reasonably approximate to the experience put into tomes.

Not sure if the developers who would do this CoP re-work are the same as the 2.5 developers... If they aren't, my comment is irrelevant, but if they are the same developers, I don't see the point in undertaking a big development project which would delay the 2.5 release even more. Imo, the 2.5 release would be so much better for the game overall.

Different folks. 2.5 takes a pretty specific skill set. Also, this is not nearly as much work as the alternative options we were discussing.

What about those players who have no tomes left to do? Would they just automatically receive the 20% bonus to their healing and damage output? And for players who have already completed their CoP's, would they just receive it off the bat or would they have to gradually re-earn it through exping other tomes?

You would already have more than enough experience in tomes to get the full benefit. Basically, if you have all available tomes done, you will have no change in power and a bunch of reimbursed experience to boot. We are looking into ways to let people use experience for expendable benefits, and there also is a whole new set of AA/leadership AAs that we can *possibly* use in 2.5.

My second is when we move over to the new tome/ situation. The lack of tomes and rising rates. My suggestion for this is an NPC that gives you a token or flag for how many CoP you have and an NPC that will give you no drop tomes of the new system. Max possibility of only 5 no drop tomes. So people have something to put reimbursed exp into without inflating the market and causing an immediate tome shortage and without putting cash back into the market if you did cash reimbursement.

Given that CoPower was simply purchased, I am not sure if I am comfortable giving players who bought them credit for dropped tomes. What we are doing, though, is greatly increasing the places where you can get lower tier tomes. Also, the queries I have done so far seem to show that generic tomes have been dropping in price significantly. I am hoping that the greater availability will counter any shortage the change will bring, but if I am wrong I would be willing to look into remedies at that point.

While it is small potatoes, what about the cash spent on CoPs. Will platinum be reimbursed too? Some of us may find it a bit costly to move to the new system without reimbursement.

Not sure about this as of yet. If people actually saved their tomes, this is easy. We just make the tomes droppable and give them a merchant value. Unfortunately I think a majority of people have deleted their tomes after completion. We might be able to give the money back depending on how much experience you put into the tomes, but if it proves too difficult it is not a fatal flaw to the plan.

Will all tomes count for this (including old world, archetype, glyphs), or just the general and class tomes?

All tome experience will count.
 
Is it possible to make an npc that acts like an exp bank? Or that at least holds your potions and you hail it to get some? I don't know about most, but I'm really short on bank space and bag space in general. I'm not going to have enough tomes on hand to put the exp right into, so even if I have enough room for them, I'll be holding on to many for a while.

Might it be possible to have an NPC that tracks how much exp you're still owed and will give it to you in some increment?
 
Tangent: It seems that with both the CoP removal and the increased drop rates of tomes in old world zones, trading tomes etc will become more important. Can the LORE tag be removed from tomes to make this a little more manageable and friently? Or does the LORE tag on tomes serve some unseen-t0-me purpose?
 
I can understand not wanting to give out tomes, But look what happens to prices and tome availability just during one week of exp week. I know with the added drop rates and zones it will help but i still see a good possibility of prices going up. And the reasons prices have been so low is because of the low population of people needing them, the people still doing cops, And those done with those low cost tomes and the high drop rates of "junk" tomes. The more important ones are still 20k and take a considerable amount of time to find one and hope its not a bidding war. Avoid 2, Crit evo 2 , Mind 2 , Resil 2, Healing 2 are all expensive not to mention some class 2 tomes. Then you have all the people who have already completed codex's with this huge pool of exp sitting there, looking to a market that i am unsure can produce enough tomes right away to even counter the massive immediate demand. Maybe have tomes start dropping from those "other" zones PRIOR to when you change out codex's so it creates a buffer. Or like others have said remove the "Lore" from the books

I foresee a possible shortage and market inflation which will cause frustration. I think having a plan in place if that happens or a few solid idea's for that situation is not unwarranted. I just wanted to express a concern I am sure many see and are worried about.

Thanks for the reply.
 
Will there be more tomes available or is it same old tomes (ie the ones on Wiki that we all know of) that we can put exp into?

What im saying, the people that is more or less maxed on dropable tomes. Will they be able to find new tomes that are of use? (And Im talking about the people that is not HBM that raids and gets opuses.)
 
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