Somatic Bond and Avatar of Destruction

We have balanced this spell to do near the same damage as the old AoD and will continue to tweak it as needed to attain that goal.
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So I mean, in the perfect world, they will do this right and it will just all balance out, and the "damage" from these spells will just transition over to reflect the Enchanter doing the damage on a parse, and not the person you cast it on.

In the mage/bst pet thread, Solo specifically said

the AoD changes will be a pretty significant nerf to wizard dps.
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and I disagree in the fact that wizard dps will still be exactly the same as it was before. If this AoD is balanced properly, then that extra damage Wizards were used to seeing for themselves is just now moved over cosmetically to the Enchanter and that's all.

If AoD added 500dps to a wizard, now a wizard will do 1000dps instead of 1500, and the Enchanter will deal an extra 500.

If I am completely off base on these assumptions then by all means let me know.
 
zorlon2 said:
So I mean, in the perfect world, they will do this right and it will just all balance out, and the "damage" from these spells will just transition over to reflect the Enchanter doing the damage on a parse, and not the person you cast it on.

In the mage/bst pet thread, Solo specifically said



and I disagree in the fact that wizard dps will still be exactly the same as it was before. If this AoD is balanced properly, then that extra damage Wizards were used to seeing for themselves is just now moved over cosmetically to the Enchanter and that's all.

If AoD added 500dps to a wizard, now a wizard will do 1000dps instead of 1500, and the Enchanter will deal an extra 500.

If I am completely off base on these assumptions then by all means let me know.
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This is what it looks like to me. If anyone has ever had an Enchanter and GoG'd 5 melee with pet misses on,then they'd know just how significant of a boost it is in damage. Laughing at people screaming for joy over their 14k crits,not knowing that 4k+ of it wasn't even theirs. Applying AoD whether it is better on a Necro/Wiz/Mage or whatever, is at the Enchanters discretion. The best part about this spell is the Enchanter still gets to choose who gets it. Be lucky you even get it ! If you get it. A vast amount of all those pretty crits you were drooling over weren't yours to begin with.(this is directed to recipients of AoD,not anyone in particular)
 
zorlon2 said:
If AoD added 500dps to a wizard, now a wizard will do 1000dps instead of 1500, and the Enchanter will deal an extra 500.

If I am completely off base on these assumptions then by all means let me know.
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No, this is wrong. Something like half of an AoD'ed wizard's dps is from ultimate blasts. Enchanters cannot ultimate blast. So instead of adding 500 DPS to the wizard, AoD wil add ~250 dps to the enchanter.
 
zorlon2 said:
If I am completely off base on these assumptions then by all means let me know.
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Yep.

Dinadass said:
No, this is wrong. Something like half of an AoD'ed wizard's dps is from ultimate blasts. Enchanters cannot ultimate blast. So instead of adding 500 DPS to the wizard, AoD wil add ~250 dps to the enchanter.
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This.

The way the spell works has fundamentally changed, its not as simple as changing how parses show damage.

AoD benefitted wizards more than other classes because we can ultimate/primal. The additional spell crit brought wizards from 1000 dps to 1500 dps.

The new spell has nothing to do with spell crit, instead it mimics the spells cast by the player. So, you mimic the spells of a wizard doing 1000 dps and do 50% of their damage. You might initally assume that is 500 dps, but you are missing the fact that the wizard gets to 1000 damage because of his ultimate/primal blasts, which the enchanter cannot repeat. The enchanter in turn will get something like 250-300 dps.

And... this is a nerf to wizards, whether that is intended or not. Not going to say its a bad thing until I get some good parses in, but classes get balanced around buffs from other classes whether we like it or not, and for a long time now wizard raid dps has been hugely influenced by AoD. Ive explained pretty thoroughly why the change will have a greater impact on wizard dps than any other class.
 
zorlon2 said:
Refer to the quote about balancing the spell so that it stays the same.
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Yeah, that is fine, but we are talking about the way it is now. You know as well as anyone that disclaimers like that do not necessarily come true, and if they are to come true, then I am doing exactly what is needed by explaining why/how the current spell will not reflect the way AoD increased dps before.

I've been going back and forth a lot, but I'm not even all that opposed to the spell. My class does less dps, but hopefully that will allow us to get some cool things via tomes/other to compensate that before this change would not happen.

It is without a doubt a good thing to have aod/gog dps reflected in the enchanters parse.
 
I'm not seeing my enchanter mimic any spells.
On a raid boss, she parsed 50 dps (without the dot).
 
On the bright side this will open up more diverse gear choices for Enchanters to do Max DPS on raids.

On the downside, Enchanters now need pretty much every tome to do optimal DPS on raids...

Time to see what the optimal gear set that includes Cold, Disease, Fire, Magic, and Poison focuses as well as DI and AE is.
 
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Somebody load Zorlon and group with 3 casters and go chain cast AOD and blow shit up and see if the 4.3 sword focus kills him really fast.
 
I'm not completely clear on this and it doesn't fit with the current conversation in this thread but I think it belongs here. Does the new GoG require the enchanter to be actively meleeing the mob? Must the enchanter be in melee range? If so, doesn't that kinda screw over enchanters a little bit in the case of AEs and such?
 
Cool thanks! This bit from the front page just had me confused, and I did not completely understand what you meant by "functionally identical"

In other words, the Enchanter becomes a conduit and mirrors part of the damage caused by the castee onto the target of the castee as his or her own melee damage
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Just gives the enchanter standard melee messages for their contribution from it. Example, if the ATK from Giantkin were worth 20% of the target's damage (made up number):

Rogue pierces a hostile target for 80 points of damage.
Rogue tries to pierce a hostile target, but misses.
Rogue pierces a hostile target for 36 points of damage.
Enchanter pierces a hostile target for 20 points of damage.
Enchanter pierces a hostile target for 9 points of damage.
Rogue backstabs a hostile target for 1076 points of damage.
Enchanter backstabs a hostile target for 270 points of damage.

The rogue is still doing all of the damage (in this case 100, then 45, then 1346). But the amount of damage owed to GoG is split off from their displayed amount and shown as a separate attack from the enchanter.
 
My enc's dps seems to range from 200-500 on tur ruj trash and named mobs, AoDing 2 wizards and mage and bonding a ranger. I now have same problem as mages, since rains land on me. The casting time of spells also bothers me, mob often dies before my spell would land on them. We think the enchanter dying might have crashed a zone, too. All in all, so far not happy with this, but have only been parsing for 2 hours (Gamparse, EQcompanion and Yalp all give similar results).
 
tinkaa said:
My enc's dps seems to range from 200-500 on tur ruj trash and named mobs, AoDing 2 wizards and mage and bonding a ranger. I now have same problem as mages, since rains land on me. The casting time of spells also bothers me, mob often dies before my spell would land on them. We think the enchanter dying might have crashed a zone, too. All in all, so far not happy with this, but have only been parsing for 2 hours (Gamparse, EQcompanion and Yalp all give similar results).
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Well, it's new and bizarre enough to be cool and interesting. There's definitely going to be kinks to work out, bugs that were unanticipated, and things like that. This is far from "finalized version".

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This change excites me kinda like the Top 5 thread comparison excite some of the people that have already posted in this thread. It will bring greater clarity to actual DPS contributions, and that will allow for more informed discussions of class comparisons.

There's been impending growing pains from mid-Ikisith raiding for a while, and it's good to see that there are finally taking place. We just need to keep in mind that none of them are happening alone and all of them are subject to being adjusted based on how they work in practice and in conjunction with other the other changes that will follow.

I look forward to seeing next week's FWF parses.
 
Tarutao said:
Well, it's new and bizarre enough to be cool and interesting. There's definitely going to be kinks to work out, bugs that were unanticipated, and things like that. This is far from "finalized version".
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I know, I actually had an excited reply written before I had time to test it, because on paper it sounded good. This is just my report from limited time use, which so far does not meet my expectations. The rain hitting me and 3 spells landing after the mob just died irk me the most.
 
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