Ranger Auto Fire

robopirateninja said:
The two best kinds of arrows in the game are free.

Besides the dmg 9 mages that is 4 stacks per raid (recast is like 2+ hours) and it consumes a FIRE OPAL, which is not free....
which is the other best arrow which is free?

nothing for rangers arrows are free, beside the dmg 1 and 3 from mages.
Eveything else, u need ingredients for combine, and money to spend on skillups.

From the guys that comparing monk weapons to rangers bows...
IIRC monks barehands are pretty awesome, which already make there 2 weapons. Im pretty sure ive seen MANY MANY 1h weapons on /auc than bows.. Even on high-end, there are so many 1h weapons agains.. hmm.. 2 bows?
 
brasileira said:
From the guys that comparing monk weapons to rangers bows...
IIRC monks barehands are pretty awesome, which already make there 2 weapons. Im pretty sure ive seen MANY MANY 1h weapons on /auc than bows.. Even on high-end, there are so many 1h weapons agains.. hmm.. 2 bows?
What is your definition of high end?

Bows that come to mind are:
Windsinger
Misery
Bloodseeker
Shooting Starmetal Ballista
Woe, Bane of the Brother

Not including Swiftshot. Sure thats 5 bows as compared to many, many 1 handers, but do the one handers have as good ratios as the bows and put out as much DPS as the bows? No.
 
Brimztone said:
What is your definition of high end?

Bows that come to mind are:
Windsinger
Misery
Bloodseeker
Shooting Starmetal Ballista
Woe, Bane of the Brother

Not including Swiftshot. Sure thats 5 bows as compared to many, many 1 handers, but do the one handers have as good ratios as the bows and put out as much DPS as the bows? No.
Again im not comparing DPS, the dps topic is another... im comparing the WORK to do DPS... rangers must click every 2-3 seconds, buy arrows, fletch, and get 5 bows.. j
 
brasileira said:
Again im not comparing DPS, the dps topic is another... im comparing the WORK to do DPS... rangers must click every 2-3 seconds, buy arrows, fletch, and get 5 bows.. j
I see what you're talking about, I just don't think Autofire is the answer.

A return of endless quiver, and the highest end arrows made no drop I think would be a good change and not unbalancing.
 
The problem with implementing a lot of bows in the high end is they're really only super useable by one class. Sucks for a raid to have bows rotting left and right - whereas one handers can be used by a variety of classes.
 
brasileira said:
But just one last thing. we have alot fewer bows than rogues/bst/monk can get PLUS we pay for our DPS.. and its not cheap.. like 10p each mob if using best arrows in game..

:what: :psyduck:

I really don't know what you're getting at here. Maybe you were meaning something other than what you typed?

In any case, rangers can avoid almost every AE in the game unless it's absolutely designed to be unavoidable; it's not like you're being bludgeoned of your money for nothing at all. You still do excellent dps, and you're nowhere near the mana sponge a rogue is on a good number of encounters.
 
ryutakin said:
What we could do is up ranger dps.

I'd be happy w/ that.. but i figured since they just nerfed the crap out of them i didnt think they'd do it. TBH rangers are pretty much crap now.
 
Xeldan said:
:what: :psyduck:

I really don't know what you're getting at here. Maybe you were meaning something other than what you typed?

In any case, rangers can avoid almost every AE in the game unless it's absolutely designed to be unavoidable; it's not like you're being bludgeoned of your money for nothing at all. You still do excellent dps, and you're nowhere near the mana sponge a rogue is on a good number of encounters.
Well its 10p per trash mob.. how many mobs are in a raid? and nameds? thats ALOT of money, compared to other classes..

Bows arent useless, they can be used by other classes, never seend RNG only useable thing(but starfall and thaz)
 
TBH this feels a lot more like a bitchfest than an attempt to get anything done.

If there's a 70+ DPS difference between RNG with top notch arrows and ROG, that's probably a bit excessive. I'll bet that if someone posted some reasonably extensive logs, with gear details, the staff would be happy to take a fresh look at the numbers and rebalance things if needed.

That hasn't been done.

90% of what I'm seeing here is "but but but... they get this and that and the other thing, and all we have is..."

In groups, rangers are good DPS and excellent utility. In raids, they're good DPS with a couple good buffs. You can bring up all you want about rogues' utility, but let's face it: They're DPS. You can't scout in high end raid zones, and for the vast majority of purposes, RNG tracking is more effective than ROG scouting anyway.

The fact of the matter is that RNG, ROG and BRD are all very different classes with different functions, benefits, and weaknesses. If you think classes are out of balance, demonstrate why. Bitching about why you're underpowered isn't going to do anything except get people's backs up and start an argument.
 
Hasrett said:
TBH this feels a lot more like a bitchfest than an attempt to get anything done.

If there's a 70+ DPS difference between RNG with top notch arrows and ROG, that's probably a bit excessive. I'll bet that if someone posted some reasonably extensive logs, with gear details, the staff would be happy to take a fresh look at the numbers and rebalance things if needed.

That hasn't been done.
Allyelin did that

Hasrett said:
In groups, rangers are good DPS and excellent utility. In raids, they're good DPS with a couple good buffs. You can bring up all you want about rogues' utility, but let's face it: They're DPS. You can't scout in high end raid zones, and for the vast majority of purposes, RNG tracking is more effective than ROG scouting anyway.
Allyelin did that
NOP, sorry to tell but if a zone have more than X (prolly 60) mobs on it, rangers track get messy and wont show right, rogues are and will be the best trackers in raid zones, rangers cant track on em, and afaik track cant be fixed due to client stuff


Hasrett said:
The fact of the matter is that RNG, ROG and BRD are all very different classes with different functions, benefits, and weaknesses. If you think classes are out of balance, demonstrate why. Bitching about why you're underpowered isn't going to do anything except get people's backs up and start an argument.
We are demonstrating, we just got 2 nerfs, we spend alot of time "clicking" a button every 2-3 sec to dps less and less, paying the max for that.

We pay alot to do the max of our dps, which isnt that good...is alot of affort for medium dps, dont think thats good enough.
 
Exactly... Allie did that, and came to the conclusions that led to the nerf. She's going to do it again with a couple slight adjustments. But people are still bitching. If you think there's something wrong with what she did, make the suggestions and move on, or post your own logs to contradict what Allie's show. The whole "but we have have to click more times" doesn't have much bearing on a systematic, numerical balancing of the classes.

And again, rogues are only the best scouts in zones where they can scout. Which means in most not-raid zones. All the new content is chock full of mobs that see through rogue hide/sneak.

As for your point about RNG balance, you may be right, but again, either make your point and move on, or elaborate with more details. Making the point over and over and over comes across as complaining, even if you're just trying to make a constructive suggestion. You wanna show that you're spending too much on arrows? Post numbers. Parse how many arrows you shoot per trash mob, per raid mob, per exp mob, and calculate the price for each of several different kinds of arrows. Compare the DPS you do with each of those to the DPS you do with melee. Make sure you post which buffs you have on, what weapons you're using, what haste you have, etc. You're saying you spend a lot of money for a small increase in DPS. That's fine, and you may well be right. Now prove it.
 
Hasrett said:
And again, rogues are only the best scouts in zones where they can scout. Which means in most not-raid zones. All the new content is chock full of mobs that see through rogue hide/sneak.
Truth.

Finally someone is saying what I was saying two pages ago!
 
I fail to see how auto fire makes up for dps nerfs? :what: If anything make a good case as to why rng dps should go up, like the amount of work it takes to make that dps happen and the cost of it. It has been stated but not in the favor of rng dps going up but in the favor of auto fire(I will assume the case was made ages ago during that rng vs rog thread and staff found it meaningless..I still say rng should be the best melee dps but it's just my opinion.) As it stands, this just sounds like an argument about boxed rangers being left alone so you can concentrate on the other box without having to hit range attack every 2 seconds, hence being a lot closer to your old dps output pre nerfs than you are currently boxing post nerf.

I guess in a sense that would make up for the nerfs, but then again I don't think it's right for any class to have the ability to be played afk(aside from the spell casting.) This would help boxed rangers, but it's certainly pointless for non boxed rangers.

I remember when rangers were nerfed hard in a different game. They had to spend money on their arrows as do rangers here. There, there is no returning shot. It's a money sink on every single arrow they fire, and they were the bucks of dps. People whined, and they were nerfed because you could just throw more rangers(also wizards, who was also nerfed awhile later) at any ole encounter to pull off the victory, leaving other classes sol for the fight. The problem there was every class that was any good over the rest got nerfed, so people moved on the new best class, repeat process. Ranger wise they made them pretty worthless. After the nerfs, rangers were as rare to find as a bard(the constant champion of least played class for years now) People were angry. Basically the nerf was taking distance from target into account for dps output. The closer you were, the less dps you did. Pre nerf you could melee and use bow at same time for max dps. In the end, it was not the rangers who quit over it. It was their guilds saying we no longer want your ranger because it "sucks" now. Find a different class to play or you can go elsewhere. Therefore, the ranger class died off. Even after nerfs they were still a dps machine, but because of the distance nerf, it made them useless on many different raids.

The point of this little story is, rangers here could have it a lot worse. You already have many nice perks of the class. Staff has enforced a limit of 3 per class for raids. You aren't going out of business. Someone has to be the best dps'er. Someone has got to be the worst dps'er. Things really could be worse. Of course, that doesn't mean you should sit down, shut up and not fight for something you want. I just think auto fire is more of a perk for boxers than making up for dps nerfs and spending any more time trying to fight this battle is a waste of time.
 
Speaking as a long time ranger, I want to restate that I am NOT in favor of autofire. From a game balance perspective, the ONLY way to justify giving autofire to rangers is to also nerf archery dps. If your character can be played at close to maximum performance with almost zero input after engage then you don't deserve to be anywhere near the head of the dps charts.

If you want to bot a high dps class that requires almost no attention then play a beastlord. Bst + pet > ranger - bow.
 
What do people think about an autofire that only works at 50% or 75% efficiency compared to actually clicking range attack when it refreshes? It wouldn't make an "afk" ranger on a raid very profitable, since the slot could easily be filled by someone who could actually play their character for more dps, but this would make rangers a less "click intensive" class for those who find it too difficult/time consuming to click range attack, while still rewarding rangers who choose to play their character to maximum efficiency. I suppose this could also provide utility if a ranger was low on arrows deep into a raid zone and wanted to accurately meter their arrow use.
 
I suspect that that just wouldn't be used. If it were that inefficient, a ranger would be better off just meleeing... or being replaced by almost any other class (sorry warriors, not you).
 
Back
Top Bottom