Congestion
- Thread starter Rouean_Onrielas
- Start date
First, Archaics should stay in prison. Now if you want a 4 piece drop to make an OP frag (in OP) or IP (in IP) frags i am very for that.
Putting them in Rust is a .. sorry to say.. is a retarded idea. Giving people who can't get into IP an advantage to get great spells that aren't a right, is just dumb.
The only prob i have with zones is IP's risk vs reward is better than all the others. Even thaz is great items for annoying clearing and actually hard encounters (need the gear to beat). There is NO reason to farm valor for Steel Ruin or Exodus compared to IP. Now when stronghold comes, in depending on what Wold puts the difficulty at and PoN, maybe IP won't look so great anymore or at least people can go to Stronghold or Nightmare instead to free up IP for others once in a while.
Exodus isn't CBing IP, they are raiding at their time which is before everyone else. Steel (not sure now but before) used to raid an hour or 2 before RUin same with Forsaken.
THe mess in IP was caused by short spawns not lack of content. When all these guilds can progress so fast you get a jumble in one zone. Thaz isn't so much CBed by Forsaken as CBed by the bosses in lower, which is just fine. Gives time for Forsaken to farm upper, and others to farm lower.
Putting them in Rust is a .. sorry to say.. is a retarded idea. Giving people who can't get into IP an advantage to get great spells that aren't a right, is just dumb.
The only prob i have with zones is IP's risk vs reward is better than all the others. Even thaz is great items for annoying clearing and actually hard encounters (need the gear to beat). There is NO reason to farm valor for Steel Ruin or Exodus compared to IP. Now when stronghold comes, in depending on what Wold puts the difficulty at and PoN, maybe IP won't look so great anymore or at least people can go to Stronghold or Nightmare instead to free up IP for others once in a while.
Exodus isn't CBing IP, they are raiding at their time which is before everyone else. Steel (not sure now but before) used to raid an hour or 2 before RUin same with Forsaken.
THe mess in IP was caused by short spawns not lack of content. When all these guilds can progress so fast you get a jumble in one zone. Thaz isn't so much CBed by Forsaken as CBed by the bosses in lower, which is just fine. Gives time for Forsaken to farm upper, and others to farm lower.
Jun
Dalayan Beginner
Valor has some nice items, I'd disagree that there is no reason for Steel or Exodus to farm it. Also, Thaz is not an annoying clear at all. Those two zones, and now Rust, are all reasonable alternatives for IP.
Also, I'd suggest that a Scale of Taeshlin be required for the Rust Archaic turn-ins.
Also, I'd suggest that a Scale of Taeshlin be required for the Rust Archaic turn-ins.
Thinkmeats
War Is Good For Business
Jun said:
Why? You still need the IP dragon box.
Syalara said:
Malluas said:
You should probably compare how many times you guys wiped to Mercury's trash vs how many times you wipe to garden-variety OP trash before complaining. Rust is many things, but it ain't a candyland. You won't be getting the frags any easier, that's for damn sure.
edit: Also, the IP-equivalent trash in Rust is by no means DB. When I talked about chewing through hp, I meant to get the gems--the stuff that drops the archies are the mobs that spawn in the events before the raid mob.
Thinkmeats
War Is Good For Business
Xeldan said:
didnt you hear? all i do is crap out ridiculously overpowered items and then put them behind encounters that are too hard / make you jump through too many hoops while channeling the spirit of nero. what an artist codes with me~~
Seriously though, it's simple enough reasoning. For Archaics, prison already has dozens of things in it--combine, huuuge items, and archaics. With all those eggs in the prison basket, is it any wonder the zone is constantly filled with guilds? It defeats the point of adding alternatives. Now that other prison level zones exist, it makes no sense gameplay-wise to keep the prison-level spells exclusive to its parent zone; it'd be like restricting relics to only ntov.
The gems thing for Rust specifically likewise has simple, but solid, reasoning behind it. By deferring the act of trash-clearing to gems, the zone lets players move the cost to wherever they want it--they can still clear with the raid to get the gems before they fight the named, but they can also buy them in /auction or go there in small groups beforehand. If a market for the boney/steely/fleshy/timeless gems appears in /auc, it has the added benefit of giving guilds something to buy from more casual players (a prison-level guild won't give two shits about your carefully-farmed mielech b loot, but they'd be interested in fleshy gems).
Since the guild can defer the timesink of trash-clearing to their wallet, the actual raid process itself can be rapid, making life easier for everyone since you don't have to get your crew together for as long to do as much--killing all four gem-activated nameds doesn't take long at all, compared to clearing motg-manis-mirrors-taeshlin. The events and fights are hard enough that you have to have serious chops to win, but "having chops" and "spending hours" aren't necessarily the same thing. If you don't want to deal with it, then no problem--prison's right where you left it, and it's entirely your decision where you spend your time--but the gem system isn't going anywhere anytime soon; I like the idea enough that I'm willing to give it plenty of time to play itself out.
Jun
Dalayan Beginner
Thinkmeats said:
Yea, I think people just had some questions at first about the Archaic thing. Initially reading it and wondering if they'd be random, have Thaz (Wis) pieces, etc. probably brought out the concerns. Being Int caster only and, from the sounds of it, rarer in Rust than in Prison, it really isn't all that insane of an idea :tinfoil:
Jun
Dalayan Beginner
Allielyn said:One thing that's really been ignored here is the extremely rapid rate of progression that 2.0 + 3-loots provides; and the congestion that this rapid progression will inevitably foster. It's like. . . getting 6 loots/mob in 1.0syduck:
Honestly though, there is content out that isn't taken advantage of enough, and more still to come. It really isn't a huge problem of widespread congestion as much as one zone being fought over and complained about.
Not to mention Lower Thaz is split by wing. Maybe IP could be split left from right, etc. No guild there could currently clear the entire zone in a single raid.
Mythryn
Dalayan Master
Forsaken cleared all of IP a few times in one go, we were about as geared as Ruin is now.volvov2 said:
and..
Gea said:
I have no problem at all with Int archaics dropping from Rust, they just shouldn't be handed to people, and it sounds like TM has that end covered well. Archaics are amazing spells and shouldn't be handed to every guild that can kill Ulaz.
so it will just be an overall change then for archaics.. which is wierd since you still need IP box.. and since there is a log jam there.. grats on waiting for that to end.
I suggest making timeless frags (all of them) drop anywhere in thaz and whatever the combination box is (if not the elemental atune thingy).
Archaic are already a pain in the ass to get with the reduced drop rate (no one liked nerfed but thats what it is) now you have to go to a different zone to get a better chance and then somehow get an IP dragon down multiple times. They were a pain to get even before the reduced drop rate. Now they are downright rare as hell.
I still think making smaller frag pieces drop in OP and IP would work better. Archaics aren't a right they are something earned
I suggest making timeless frags (all of them) drop anywhere in thaz and whatever the combination box is (if not the elemental atune thingy).
Archaic are already a pain in the ass to get with the reduced drop rate (no one liked nerfed but thats what it is) now you have to go to a different zone to get a better chance and then somehow get an IP dragon down multiple times. They were a pain to get even before the reduced drop rate. Now they are downright rare as hell.
I still think making smaller frag pieces drop in OP and IP would work better. Archaics aren't a right they are something earned
Xeldan
Staff Emeritus
The combination box for priest archaics is the Elemental Attuned Sealer. I've already talked with Zhak and Ginam to get feedback on the priest frags and have some ideas for them. I don't think I'll put them all *everywhere* - I want there to be some sort of challenge beyond farming Thaz trash since the combine box is easy to get. I think personally that the current setup for their drops is about right, but there could also be room for improvement somewhere.
Mythryn
Dalayan Master
Xeldan said:
The droprate on priest archaics seems pretty fine to me. I've been stuck on my last piece for well over two months (not including time I haven't been playing). Currently there are only 4 priest archaics to my knowledge, which seems right for the time invested.
vistachiri
Dalayan Master
Waldoff said:
Are mobs in stronghold going to be enthann flagged I assume? (obviously asking for purposes of avoiding a possible not being able to raid content if I should choose to swear to him)