You know the other thing that would be really cool? If this change came with increasing the tome bonus back to 25% like it was 100 years ago.
Codex of Power Revamp
- Thread starter Waldoff
- Start date
You know the other thing that would be really cool? If this change came with increasing the tome bonus back to 25% like it was 100 years ago.
Daffie
Dalayan Pious Diety
TBH I don't see what removing CoP has to do with making Opus/Class3-4 available to non-raiders. I think these are totally separate issues, other than "XP sinks were removed from the game and now characters can reach xp max more quickly. Because CoPs are removed, we are worried about people finishing Tomes to quickly and then leaving the game." This is not an argument I have yet seen posted... If you already have CoP done, there is zero reason this specific change should require opus/class3-4 being available to everyone (and is should be a separate argument in a different thread.) I'm not saying that I don't feel for you on the issue of "Hey, I don't raid and because of it I am progression locked unless something changes." It is a separate issue! I think that many of the class 3/4 tomes are so powerful that giving them only to raiders hurts the rest of the player base. Again, a separate issue.
Honestly, I'm with Fuwok in not understanding all the complaining about this change as it is mostly made for fresh-ish 65 players so vet players may have people to group with in the future...
1. Yeah it would be nice to be reimbursed for the money spent on the CoP tomes since pp costs to earn the CoP bonus have gone up. It's 5k though, you'll get over not getting reimbursed if you don't have the books anymore (unless you are in a situation where you are broke and have no other tomes banked/completed...) This is such a minuscule amount of money in the scheme of things, it is boggling that there were several posts arguing over it. It is something like .4% of the end game charm... It is one short night of xping (not that hard unless you are really unlucky.)
2. You get 550AA worth of xp back to be used in the future. If you have nothing to spend your xp on right now, then save it. Maybe there will be something in the future. If not, tough shit. While you were grinding out 550AA you had fun, got loot drops, got cash drops, and got to use the bonuses it enabled. There is no possible way this can be construed as 'wasted time'.
This is a good change for newer players. It will certainly help to retain newish 65s who want to enter the raid game. Take a step back from 'I' and look at 'we' for a minute. Do you really feel like you are getting shafted by this change, and is this a rational thought?
Honestly, I'm with Fuwok in not understanding all the complaining about this change as it is mostly made for fresh-ish 65 players so vet players may have people to group with in the future...
1. Yeah it would be nice to be reimbursed for the money spent on the CoP tomes since pp costs to earn the CoP bonus have gone up. It's 5k though, you'll get over not getting reimbursed if you don't have the books anymore (unless you are in a situation where you are broke and have no other tomes banked/completed...) This is such a minuscule amount of money in the scheme of things, it is boggling that there were several posts arguing over it. It is something like .4% of the end game charm... It is one short night of xping (not that hard unless you are really unlucky.)
2. You get 550AA worth of xp back to be used in the future. If you have nothing to spend your xp on right now, then save it. Maybe there will be something in the future. If not, tough shit. While you were grinding out 550AA you had fun, got loot drops, got cash drops, and got to use the bonuses it enabled. There is no possible way this can be construed as 'wasted time'.
This is a good change for newer players. It will certainly help to retain newish 65s who want to enter the raid game. Take a step back from 'I' and look at 'we' for a minute. Do you really feel like you are getting shafted by this change, and is this a rational thought?
CharmCitysKing
Dalayan Elder
My first unread post from this thread is on page 7...
Can anyone briefly summarize at this point what the story is with CoP change? I'm writing a thesis atm and just don't have the time to sift through 13 pages of discussion.
Can anyone briefly summarize at this point what the story is with CoP change? I'm writing a thesis atm and just don't have the time to sift through 13 pages of discussion.
Yale1
Dalayan Adventurer
Let me reply with my own reply, I guess time will tell, not going to try and convince people of something painfully obvious , its a waste of time , ill take my leave of this discussion, GL
Unless kill flags on AA on live are new they didn't exist when I last played in spring 2009 when my beast Jevin was ranked 3rd on server for hp #1 for attack and 97th over all game wide not just server.
Daffie
Dalayan Pious Diety
Maybe, and the question of if we should make this change at all is certainly a valid question. I was more pointing out the arguments for post change 'give me, give me'.
On live, at least before the current AA window modernization, AA were unlocked through level/AA count/prereq AAs/and kills-achievements. An example of kill-achivement AAs are Trials of Mata Muram in the Omens of War expansion. (This is the same expansion that introduced the next epic quests 1.5/2.0 and was actually a really fun and well thought out expansion.) I believe the trials were accessed through a zone called Proving Grounds and there were 6 trials. I remember these specifically because doing them on tier was very difficult without the right group setup for each specific trial. I failed at them a lot
EDIT - I forgot leadership AAs that can only be XPed if certain conditions are met. Namely, the character is leader of the group and/or leader of the raid.
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darksabbath
Dalayan Master
The briefest of summaries:
Devs: We are working on it, and almost done.
The Rest: split between "hooray thank you", and "whine, cry, gimme gimme"
CharmCitysKing
Dalayan Elder
Yes I imagine 12 3/4 of those 13 pages are of the latter.
CharmCitysKing
Dalayan Elder
Wait was that you who had Nebi at #5 or the dude u took over Nebi from had him at #5?
It would seem a discussion on the merits of making opus/class 3&4 tomes open to people unable to get them, should be on a separate thread. Which, they are in S&R. It is a lot of the rehashing of old comments. I will try to give a brief, biased summary from what I remember.
People for opening them up: People are running out of tomes to do, and are unable to get opus and class 3/4. This is a bad.
People who are able to get the tomes as is: Those tomes are half of the raid loot of Turruj (this is an extremely fair point, because this is true). By opening them up, you kind of negate the reason for raiding that zone.
Some suggestions people made, w/o citation.
Let people get one, but make it require 2-5 x the exp to fill as a raid dropped version, and maybe cost like 30 k pp.
Maybe implement some form of refugee bounty system, that way the rate of new tome acquisition can be easily controlled (So raiding is still the preferred method). Also, make the acquired tome, randomly given out like relics. That way people can't pick and chose the best tomes.
I think someone suggested charging just like 100 k for one. Stuff like that.
Anyways, I for one think the CoP change is good.
People for opening them up: People are running out of tomes to do, and are unable to get opus and class 3/4. This is a bad.
People who are able to get the tomes as is: Those tomes are half of the raid loot of Turruj (this is an extremely fair point, because this is true). By opening them up, you kind of negate the reason for raiding that zone.
Some suggestions people made, w/o citation.
Let people get one, but make it require 2-5 x the exp to fill as a raid dropped version, and maybe cost like 30 k pp.
Maybe implement some form of refugee bounty system, that way the rate of new tome acquisition can be easily controlled (So raiding is still the preferred method). Also, make the acquired tome, randomly given out like relics. That way people can't pick and chose the best tomes.
I think someone suggested charging just like 100 k for one. Stuff like that.
Anyways, I for one think the CoP change is good.
Maybe, and the question of if we should make this change at all is certainly a valid question. I was more pointing out the arguments for post change 'give me, give me'.
On live, at least before the current AA window modernization, AA were unlocked through level/AA count/prereq AAs/and kills-achievements. An example of kill-achivement AAs are Trials of Mata Muram in the Omens of War expansion. (This is the same expansion that introduced the next epic quests 1.5/2.0 and was actually a really fun and well thought out expansion.) I believe the trials were accessed through a zone called Proving Grounds and there were 6 trials. I remember these specifically because doing them on tier was very difficult without the right group setup for each specific trial. I failed at them a lot
EDIT - I forgot leadership AAs that can only be XPed if certain conditions are met. Namely, the character is leader of the group and/or leader of the raid.
they do not unlock AA (didn't remember them doing that myself when I did them on tier) http://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/quest.html?quest=2978
the only things in EQ live that raids/group tasks unlocked was a handfull of combat abilities and spells.
the only AA that required raids were raid leader AA's, literally thousands of AA that did not require raids. and the argument that it would eliminate half the loot in turuj is only used because it is currently loot there other wise people would progress through turuj like any other raid zone.
my beast is on bertox server if you want infos hit me up on cw forums
Nebi
Dalayan Pious Diety
on shards of dalaya....
Yale1
Dalayan Adventurer
I hope for your sake this isn't mocking me
I am hoping that it will be on fomelo at some point, but do not expect it to be on first release. I also would not mind adding it to self /cmd stats as well as possible in game messages at some set of milestones.