What's up with no mana regen after death/rez?

H

hooden

Dalayan Beginner
Well, my group and I just had the lovely privelage of wiping twice and wasting an incredibly unnecessary amount of time. Can anyone tell me why this no mana regen is in game? The only thing I can think of is zerging raids, but there has to be a less damaging way to accomplish this.

It just seems so pointless to me to stand around and wait for death effects to fade, med up for the TP, then go get rezzed, then wait again for rez effects to fade, and then be able to med up from 0 and work your way back. This is such a time sink, and I'm trying to recall, but I think Wiz put in the fast mana regen because he was all about reducing downtime and adding more fun. Well, I can't help but think this action is the exact opposite.
 
Death effects are a penalty for death. If you can successfully accomplish not dying then the mana regen will definitely help your down time. Especially when it comes to buffing up for raids.

It all boils down to... do your best not to die.
 
I'm not really big on this new change either. I like reducing the attack of melees so they can't attack until death fatigue wears off. But since the casters can't regen mana, it's almost like having double death fatigue. We have to wait to start regening until death fatigue fades, then buff, create pets and stuff, and then be FM before we start up. It seems like double death fatigue for casters. My suggestion would be to keep the -1000 mana on during death fatigue, but once it fades, do +5000 mana for 1 tick, to get everyone close or at FM. That way, when the melees are ready to fight, the casters would be as well. This will help speed raid wipes and stuff again.
 
Having this effect upon death and resurrection is definately overkill. I think one of the two needs to be eliminated. Perhaps prolong one of the two a little longer but having to wait after death and then wait after res both is unnecessary IMO. Maybe even keep both but reduce the downtime. I imagine this was implemented in order to prevent zerging certain mobs but I believe there would be better alternatives to this such as increased regeneration rates on mobs when not engaged in battle.
 
Perhaps some kind of system to only allow beneficial spells to be cast after death/rez for a certain period of time would alleviate the problem of bind zerging, and remove the current harsh punishment for everyone else...
 
Wiz said:
People just love bind zerging. This exists because they do.
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Ok, I'm not exactly sure how the zerging is going down because I have never used this tactic. But, it's obviously a problem for some people, which now created a problem for every single person on the server. Since this is obviously a problem, why don't you implement adept-type re-engagement rules? It could either be applied to every raid target in a bindable zone, or you could just pick out the ones that are being zerged.

I don't think people should zerg, and I don't think people should totally waste their time like they do with this new system.
 
Or mark zerging as an exploitation (which it is as much as using zoning/evac etc) and then just ban people who do it? People fear the bannage.
 
This is frustrating when a raid wipes and you have to get everyone ressed. However, I understand the reason for it and don't really know a better alternative atm.

You could make casting impossible (soemthing like silence?) until rez effects fade, but still allow mana regen. This would essentially give a 3 (or is it 5?) minute penalty after death, but allow casters to be ready to go by the time rez effects fade. Clerics still would not be able to rez, but after the effects fade

You could allow only certain spells to be cast (res for example?) but this sounds like too much coding.

Summoning pets gives you a tank, which would allow zerging, which is what this is trying to avoid.

Being able to rez a raid and hold off any respawn while regrouping is a necessity.

Maybe mobs could simply go to full health if out of combat for more than 2 minutes, but this doesn't really adress the problem of zerging, since you could just keep rezing in tanks as they died.

Maybe a combination of these would work, a lesser penalty on attack and mana, or maybe a shorter duration.

I can see problems with any and all of these solutions, but if anyone else has ideas, I think this is the place to post them. If someone can post an idea that prevents zerging and allows recovery, but is not a PITA to code, the devs do respond to good suggestions. Simply bitching won't help though, post a better idea instead.
 
Zaos said:
Or mark zerging as an exploitation (which it is as much as using zoning/evac etc) and then just ban people who do it? People fear the bannage.
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This would make a shitload mroe work for the GMs. I don't think they particularly enjoy banning people, not to mention they could better spend their time developing, or maybe enjoying the game themselves.
 
aarielly said:
This is frustrating when a raid wipes and you have to get everyone ressed. However, I understand the reason for it and don't really know a better alternative atm.

You could make casting impossible (soemthing like silence?) until rez effects fade, but still allow mana regen. This would essentially give a 3 (or is it 5?) minute penalty after death, but allow casters to be ready to go by the time rez effects fade. Clerics still would not be able to rez, but after the effects fade

You could allow only certain spells to be cast (res for example?) but this sounds like too much coding.

Summoning pets gives you a tank, which would allow zerging, which is what this is trying to avoid.

Being able to rez a raid and hold off any respawn while regrouping is a necessity.

Maybe mobs could simply go to full health if out of combat for more than 2 minutes, but this doesn't really adress the problem of zerging, since you could just keep rezing in tanks as they died.

Maybe a combination of these would work, a lesser penalty on attack and mana, or maybe a shorter duration.

I can see problems with any and all of these solutions, but if anyone else has ideas, I think this is the place to post them. If someone can post an idea that prevents zerging and allows recovery, but is not a PITA to code, the devs do respond to good suggestions. Simply bitching won't help though, post a better idea instead.
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Just Silence isn't enough, people can keep a mob choked by throwing melees on it until all casters have lost death effects.

You just have to deal with 4 minutes extra downtime, considering how much med change lowered downtime I think you can live with it.
 
so basicly a melee can go fight right after DF is over but a caster is screwed and has to wait till his mana is back before he goes back engaging, way to go downtime :D
 
Well a melee can run upto the mob and hit it.. once.. but then again so can a caster if they wanted to.
 
Laksha said:
so basicly a melee can go fight right after DF is over but a caster is screwed and has to wait till his mana is back before he goes back engaging, way to go downtime :D
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*BREAKING NEWS* Melees have less downtime than casters when they do not need heals *BREAKING NEWS*
 
Death Fatigue
Decrease Mana by 1000 per tick
Decrease Attack Speed by 99% <---------------- I can solo with DF like the kool kids who smoke rocks behind the gym.
 
For another game, as soon as aggro is lost on bind-rushable mobs, the mobs either instantly regenerated full HP, or had 10,000% regeneration. Simply put, if you lost, then you lost. There was no way to get back into the fight after death. Also, no mobs should have very slow HP regen. This makes it so that even far to reach mobs become bind-rushable.

This is a good alternative fix and should focus on mobs that have bind points nearby, and/or mobs that are easily reachable by some other means after a death.

For most raid bosses and regular dungeon play where bind-rushing is an invalid tactic (since it is too far to run to the boss to bind-rush), this change greatly increases the downtime required to get back to gaming--and downtime isn't fun :)

This change also discourages raids from trying new strategies on bosses, because let's say a boss takes 5 attempts as you try 5 different strategies... the new changes just added 50 minutes to that process--and that's 50 minutes of doing nothing but sitting there watching res effects. It does encourage raids to begin camping a cleric bot for the sole purpose of res'ing people after a try. ;P

Of course... it makes Lifeward all the more invaluable. :D
 
Wiz said:
Just Silence isn't enough, people can keep a mob choked by throwing melees on it until all casters have lost death effects.

You just have to deal with 4 minutes extra downtime, considering how much med change lowered downtime I think you can live with it.
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What about the adept-style engagement that I mentioned previously? I don't see why that wouldn't work, and then we would be able to shorten downtime by using the old normal med rules.
 
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