Wizard Murk Spell

Silosobi

Silosobi

Dalayan Pious Diety
This has been brought up a number of times over the years, but the last thread I could find with search seemed pretty outdated, so I decided to just make a new thread.

The current wizard murk spell is essentially useless. Between resist changes, and the raid game shifting away from terrible mechanics like counterspell and super-high-resists (BTW- THANK YOU - this makes the game so much better, being worthless on random fights bc of unavoidable mechanics is not fun at all) I really just don't see this spell having any role in the game.

I'm hoping we can get it changed to something that would actually get used, so here are a few ideas:

Elemental Outbreak
Mana cost: 1000
Cast time: 7s
Recharge time: none
Effect: PBAE 900 Magic -25 resist
PBAE 600 Fire -25 resist
PBAE 600 Cold -25 resist

At higher tiers a number of classes become better than wizards at PBAE DPS. IDK if this is intended, but an upgraded PBAE that isnt as situational/long cooldown as Abstraction would be a nice addition. Less efficent than abstraction, but lack of stun means it is useful in some different situations.

Time Portal
Mana Cost: 1500
Cast time: 10s
Recharge time: 10min
Effect: Causes entire raid to rezone (or refresh), basically you leave the game, reload the zone, and reappear back where you were.

I think this would be an awesome way to give wizards some utility. I posted something like this before, but recently I have been seeing a bug where barrier wisps agro players, preventing our raid from rezzing, and we have to tediously make everyone log out and back in before we can rez. This spell would be an easy fix to any situation like that (which isnt too uncommon). It would also provide a sort of evac-in-place, if you can do it somewhere away from mob spawn location. Wizards already end up using Mass Relocation type spells to attempt to speed up wipe recovery, but people end up crashing and missing the port back and wasting extra time. This would help speed up wipe recovery, help add a bit of utility for raids (and moreso) 6man, help fix bugs, and be a very situational thing. Overall, I think its a great option for our murk spell, not providing any direct - numerical buff, but adding to wizard utility in line with the abilities we already have.
 
Wizard damage is fine where it is. And the second option would allow pretty unprecedented control of other people in the raid, and would be very hard to make non exploitable.

I am not entirely against changing the Wizard murk spell, but if you want it to change to something that will help high tier wizards in a non peripheral way, it is not going to happen.
 
As much as I'd love to ask for the oft-mentioned pbaoe concuss, that seems way op, but would a targetable concuss where like the druid or another wiz, etc. takes agro, you target them and make them lose some agro or target their mob and make it be concussed towards its target, be possible at all? Wouldn't help the wizard much, but would add some utility.

Or this would be kinda weak, but a targetable ivu would at least be better than the nothing the spell is good for now, /shrug.
 
How about a concuss that drops a set % of aggro from everyone but tanks? Cast on mob everyone but the tanks drop a % of aggro, or if doing it by class isn't possible how about anyone not directly infront of the mob drops a % of aggro.
 
a targetted force concuss actually sounds pretty cool. a spell that the wizard casts on a target that makes them force cast concuss on their current target
 
Waldoff said:
Wizard damage is fine where it is. And the second option would allow pretty unprecedented control of other people in the raid, and would be very hard to make non exploitable.

I am not entirely against changing the Wizard murk spell, but if you want it to change to something that will help high tier wizards in a non peripheral way, it is not going to happen.
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The burst damage in short straight fights may be fine but most high tier fights involve running around like idiots making it difficult to cast anything but fast nukes. Also the latest nerfs have increased the hit points on several mobs substantially. I ran out of mana on the Gru'niet tribe when the mob was at 40%

How about a spell that is more mana efficient than Moon Comet but reduces DPS l so where Solo can now routinely DPS at 1.6K he could DPS at 1K for twice as long? This would be useful in groups where the action is frantic and nobody ever stops to let the poor wizard med.

Alternatively, how about a spell that makes us less squishy for say 2 minutes at a time for a cost of 350-500 mana that could be cast on mem-blurring mobs.
 
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Goldfolk said:
I ran out of manner on the Gru'niet tribe when the mob was at 40%
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Terrible example as this encounter is not balanced at all, slaar tried to fix it but lol.

Wizzard damage even on long fights is fine, Nwaij and Solo both managed to not OOM on 99% of fights, i guess gruniet and maybe that OG thing are the only 2 i can think of where either of them are going to go oom. and both of these encounters could prob use some more tweaking.
 
I agree that mana is not normally an issue but the latest 'tweaks' have substantially increased the hit points of several mobs.

I don't really mind what they do with the spell as long as they do something remotely useful which is not the case now.

We could also do with a revamp on our AAs as exodus is still bugged and mana burn and life fire have virtually no use at high tiers. Our swords AA is pretty but useless. Quick gate has marginal use at best.
 
cian2 said:
what do you oom on other than gruniet (which can be done with one group anyways)
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Fight has been changed now has about double the hit points previously.

On tier Gongo and although I'm very new to the fight Custodian seemed quite mana intensive

It would also be very useful in group situations where the group is a little light on DPS
 
make wizards murk spell single target casted divine rage with 18 second recast and require a pearl
 
huey said:
As much as I'd love to ask for the oft-mentioned pbaoe concuss, that seems way op, but would a targetable concuss where like the druid or another wiz, etc. takes agro, you target them and make them lose some agro or target their mob and make it be concussed towards its target, be possible at all? Wouldn't help the wizard much, but would add some utility.

Or this would be kinda weak, but a targetable ivu would at least be better than the nothing the spell is good for now, /shrug.
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My first reaction to this idea is that I really liked it. I still like it after some thought, but I am also worried that it will step on the toes of what has historically been in the purview of Enchanters. I am still mulling it over to be honest.

As for this new "naming a few fights I run out of mana" thing, I have no idea where people got the idea that a wizard running out of mana on tier appropriate content is somehow a problem. It is not. Unless you want to give us some sort of concrete explanation of why wizard damage is not where it should be (and I think you would be hard pressed to do this), I am not sure what to tell you.

You are not going to get much sympathy from the dev team by solely pointing out that there are now fights you have to watch your mana on. That really is how it should be on at least a good proportion of content.
 
Waldoff said:
As for this new "naming a few fights I run out of mana" thing, I have no idea where people got the idea that a wizard running out of mana on tier appropriate content is somehow a problem. It is not.
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Well, if you exchange "wizard" with "magician", maybe this statement makes sense, but for wizards, it doesn't.

A wizard that runs out of mana before the end of the fight is doing it wrong. Between 5mana nukes and Arcane Echo, if they don't have the mana to do archaic nukes straight through the fight (with intensify casted on cooldown), they should be weaving in 5mana nukes along the way. If you run out of mana and resort to 5mana nukes, then on the next attempt, you should weave in a few 5mana nukes earlier in the fight.

Casting a 5mana nuke earlier in the fight after an archaic nuke is preferable to waiting until you're OOM because you get an extra tick of Arcane Echo off of your big nuke, and that delays the time at which you reach OOM by longer than just the cast of the 5mana nuke.

Off-topic note, I love my swords swarm pet. That's an AA of mine that I don't want changed.
 
Tarutao said:
A wizard that runs out of mana before the end of the fight is doing it wrong.
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Rises to bait:

I run out of mana when the fight is changed so that mob has much more hit points and we are doing it for the first time. On a side note intensify didn't seem to increase on Gru'niet at all.

Also was just making suggestions but wiz DPS is not my main issue, it's squishiness on even trash mobs when I get 1 shotted on any bad pull.

Is caster dps squishiness inevitable because other class seem to be far less fragile.
 
Tarutao said:
Well, if you exchange "wizard" with "magician", maybe this statement makes sense, but for wizards, it doesn't.

A wizard that runs out of mana before the end of the fight is doing it wrong. Between 5mana nukes and Arcane Echo, if they don't have the mana to do archaic nukes straight through the fight (with intensify casted on cooldown), they should be weaving in 5mana nukes along the way. If you run out of mana and resort to 5mana nukes, then on the next attempt, you should weave in a few 5mana nukes earlier in the fight.

Casting a 5mana nuke earlier in the fight after an archaic nuke is preferable to waiting until you're OOM because you get an extra tick of Arcane Echo off of your big nuke, and that delays the time at which you reach OOM by longer than just the cast of the 5mana nuke.

Off-topic note, I love my swords swarm pet. That's an AA of mine that I don't want changed.
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I am the one who came up with Arcane Echo, and this is exactly what I had hoped for when we put it in.

That being said, I think it was relatively clear I was referring to "running out of mana when chain casting full damage nukes" when talking about a wizard running OOM on fights. Spreading yourself out on long fights is exactly what we want to see happen.
 
Well your experience is way different from mine, where casters (with mana) are nearly always beaten by Rangers, Rogues and Monks.
(Maybe down to no 4.3 Swords?).

So I would expect they will also manage it in fights where casters go OOM (or have to throttle back their dps to avoid going OOM) but just by a considerably larger margin.
 
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