Tevinter
Dalayan Pious Diety
I fixed that for you Cless
SoD's bottleneck
- Thread starter guanfei
- Start date
I fixed that for you Cless
i hate to link to a wow website but here is what rested xp would be http://www.wowwiki.com/Rest
Sorry this makes no sense to me.If you play for an hour you should get xp for an hour and not for
1 1/4h or 1 1/2h or w/e the actual number is.
Ludovician
Dalayan Elder
That bonus will only be for people who are offline for days at a time and don't ever get to really grind / play the game.
It's that attitude that kills games like this. Shards doesn't cater to the casual player at all. If you can only log in for an hour a night due to life restrictions then you might as well not play the way things are.
You log in, LFG for (best case scenario) 10 minutes, find a group, spend 20 min loading buff bots, decide to go to Zone XYZ - spend 15 minutes getting the whole group there by boxing in a porter, using MoP with people dying, etc. Get to XP zone, wait for tank and DPS to do clickies and last minute buffs and hey look you have 10 minutes to xp.
I'd love to see this game be more casual friendly. I don't care that I spent a shitload of time getting COPs done and all my AAs and raiding, I was able to fit it in. Let the next guy do it easier so I have someone to play with.
Moraelintz
Dalayan Elder
If you are a casual and going through all of that then you are doing it wrong. Also most casuals probably don't care that much about reaching 550aas and 50tomes. They play to have fun an do whatever it is that they like doing.
If anything needs to be done it should be to reduce the exp needed for cop. The rest of the books an aas are fine. Cop is just a long grind that can be disheartening, but worth it.
Kedrin
Dalayan Pious Diety
Why should people be rewarded for not playing for days at a time? How is rested exp a better solution then just giving an experience bonus to the characters that need it, aka characters who are doing AA's and their first few tomes?
Not liking rested experience doesn't mean people want new players to suffer. The majority of high end players would love to see the game easier to "get into" for new players. It isn't hard to find posts from FWF players asking for exp to be faster for fresh 65's.
This sounds like there is a problem with buffing more so then the lack of rested experience. The buffing problem has been posted about numerous times. It seems like the admins of SoD like how tedious and terrible the buffing system in the game currently is. It's sad but for the time being we as players just have to deal with it.
Ludovician
Dalayan Elder
I'm not asking for a reward, and I'm not saying it would be better than an XP bonus - I agree with you that a bonus to new 65s would be nice, but it hasn't happened yet and maybe it's time to talk about alternatives is all. However, that XP bonus wouldn't level the field between hardcore / casual as much, as every hardcore player would get to take full advantage of it too. I consider myself pretty hardcore on this game, and I want more people to play with!
Obviously rested xp shouldn't "make up for" the 6 missed days of grinding if you only log in once per week. The person who plays hardcore should always get more out of it but the person who isn't able to play hardcore should at least not have to worry about falling behind after 3 weeks of not griding super hard.
I only like the idea because in our guild we have people who just can't XP as hard as we need them to, and it will eventually hurt the guild as a whole. This would help them keep up a bit.
I didn't mean to imply it meant you wanted people to suffer. But IMO who cares if the guy who logs in once or twice a week gets more XP for those few hours of play than I would.
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Agree 100%. Buffing is a pain in the ass and forming a group and getting things going takes way too long. That's the nature of this game though unfortunately and short of NPC buff bots I don't see a lot of solution for it. Honestly if there were buff bots that gave XP debt to use or cost plat I'd totally use them. That doesn't mean Random Group Member #2 would be willing to use them and you'd probably end up having to wait for him to load bots to buff himself anyhow. This is a shitty problem!
CharmCitysKing
Dalayan Elder
Seems like it would be a great benefit to the 1-60 crowd (and even 65's) make an NPC that casted non-relic shammy, druid, chanter etc. buffs for a fee. There is technically a system like this in the game already, as the healers in each town cast inner fire? or some other meager HP buff. Expanding this to cover a range of buffs would really improve the experience of the pre-raid populaiton
3-boxing in towns would certainly make it quicker and more enjoyable to do the "+" content but it has been brought up before and doesn't seem to have much favor with the staff.
3-boxing in towns would certainly make it quicker and more enjoyable to do the "+" content but it has been brought up before and doesn't seem to have much favor with the staff.
Kedrin
Dalayan Pious Diety
Three boxing in towns is just not thinking far enough. All buffs should just be soul bound as well as last forever untill you click them.
The only better idea is to do away with buffs altogether and give each class a small group/raid buff just for being there. They would have to be rather small and just for flavor so one class isn't wanted just for their class buff. Doing this would make the whole game have to be redone to change the difficulties of fights without having buffs. So just making buffs soul bound and last forever is a much easier fix.
The only better idea is to do away with buffs altogether and give each class a small group/raid buff just for being there. They would have to be rather small and just for flavor so one class isn't wanted just for their class buff. Doing this would make the whole game have to be redone to change the difficulties of fights without having buffs. So just making buffs soul bound and last forever is a much easier fix.
Ludovician
Dalayan Elder
I like the idea of perma SB buffs a lot. I don't think it should apply to *all* buffs, but definitely to the essential ones.
For instance, EMP should be perma, but GoE should not since it's such a big DPS boost over emp. Same with things like Savagery, Cunning, etc.
Damage shields are iffy and could go either way.
The thing is that people really don't ever go out without buffs for XP groups, so why make them take the time to do all of them? I never considered perma SB buffs but I think it's a great idea. It solves the 3 boxing in towns debate, the takes-too-long-to-get-going problem, it doesn't make death unpunished because you still get XP debt and have to get back to where you're going.
For instance, EMP should be perma, but GoE should not since it's such a big DPS boost over emp. Same with things like Savagery, Cunning, etc.
Damage shields are iffy and could go either way.
The thing is that people really don't ever go out without buffs for XP groups, so why make them take the time to do all of them? I never considered perma SB buffs but I think it's a great idea. It solves the 3 boxing in towns debate, the takes-too-long-to-get-going problem, it doesn't make death unpunished because you still get XP debt and have to get back to where you're going.
quote Ludovician:
"That bonus will only be for people who are offline for days at a time and don't ever get to really grind / play the game."
Again this strange idea to get xp for NOT playing the game.
quote Ludovician:
"It's that attitude that kills games like this. Shards doesn't cater to the casual player at all. If you can only log in for an hour a night due to life restrictions then you might as well not play the way things are."
If you can only log in for an hour then very likely SoD isnt the game for you.
quote Ludovician:
"You log in, LFG for (best case scenario) 10 minutes, find a group, spend 20 min loading buff bots..."
I wouldnt bother with finding a group at all if I only had an hour,I just log my box in which
is already in a combat zone,and you buff for 5 hours in 20m not for 1 hour.
quote Moraelin:
"If anything needs to be done it should be to reduce the exp needed for cop. "
Filled almost 4 CoPs in ~2 months,very rarely going for pure xp,I think thats fine.
quote Kedrin:
"It seems like the admins of SoD like how tedious and terrible the buffing system in the game currently is."
On the other hand after spending 20m buffing you now are able to do some high speed killing
for 5 hours.
-buffbots and permanent buffs
... would fundamentally change the game .Also we already have kind of permanent buffs,
they are called potions and clickies.
- in general:
Starting UI needs some work so that it looks less cluttered.
Shorten the dream substabtially,throw new players into the action faster.
Do something about the death trap called MoP.
Shorten traveling times for *new* players.
Talking about tomes xp isnt related to getting and keeping new players at all,
we all should try to keep this out of threads like this,it only discourages them if they read it.
"That bonus will only be for people who are offline for days at a time and don't ever get to really grind / play the game."
Again this strange idea to get xp for NOT playing the game.
quote Ludovician:
"It's that attitude that kills games like this. Shards doesn't cater to the casual player at all. If you can only log in for an hour a night due to life restrictions then you might as well not play the way things are."
If you can only log in for an hour then very likely SoD isnt the game for you.
quote Ludovician:
"You log in, LFG for (best case scenario) 10 minutes, find a group, spend 20 min loading buff bots..."
I wouldnt bother with finding a group at all if I only had an hour,I just log my box in which
is already in a combat zone,and you buff for 5 hours in 20m not for 1 hour.
quote Moraelin:
"If anything needs to be done it should be to reduce the exp needed for cop. "
Filled almost 4 CoPs in ~2 months,very rarely going for pure xp,I think thats fine.
quote Kedrin:
"It seems like the admins of SoD like how tedious and terrible the buffing system in the game currently is."
On the other hand after spending 20m buffing you now are able to do some high speed killing
for 5 hours.
-buffbots and permanent buffs
... would fundamentally change the game .Also we already have kind of permanent buffs,
they are called potions and clickies.
- in general:
Starting UI needs some work so that it looks less cluttered.
Shorten the dream substabtially,throw new players into the action faster.
Do something about the death trap called MoP.
Shorten traveling times for *new* players.
Talking about tomes xp isnt related to getting and keeping new players at all,
we all should try to keep this out of threads like this,it only discourages them if they read it.
Why does it have to be that way? Not everyone who wants to play this game can poopsock 4 hours a day. There should be something for them too. I think SoD can have a wide range of content for any type of play style without having to compromise.
Also I still don't think you grasp the concept of rested XP. Its not like you gain xp logged out from the game. If you don't play the game you stay at the same xp that you had.
With rested XP you are basically getting XP for doing nothing, because you build up a bonus someone without having rested would have, so then when you 2 go out to xp together the person with the bonus is getting more XP then the one who isn't, defacto giving you xp for doing nothing
If this argument makes sense, where are the pitchforks against adventure bands? Adventure bands are all the same stuff, but far worse: the person who plays a lot takes reduced exp so that someone can get exp for doing nothing, and unlike rested exp they wouldn't even have to do any work to claim it, they can just log in and be done.
There could be a lot of different ways to handle rested exp (is it a rising % bonus for a fixed length of time? fixed amount of exp? fixed percentage of your level? fixed % for a rising length/amount of exp/percantage of level? rising bonus for a rising duration (exponential)? something else? capped by real time without getting exp, by real time logged out, uncapped, diminishing returns?). But regardless of how it's done, it would almost certainly leave the person who doesn't play for weeks far, far behind the person who grinds for 5 hours a day (unless these two were in the same adventure band, anyway). Knowing that the person who plays a lot is always going to be ahead, what is actually offensive about letting someone who plays less be left ever so slightly less in the dust? If it's about "getting so and so far should take at least x amount of time," why are we not smiting power-levelers, twinkers, leechers, tier-skippers?
Having very briefly played a game with rested exp of some sort I think I can say with certainty that (at least on that game), rested exp was far from "rewarding people for not playing the game." It wasn't even really an effective "catch up bonus" for casual players, since it capped after a day and was relative to your current level. At most, it was a feel-good feature. A brief spurt of double exp felt like slightly less of a slog. It was nice. Would have gotten, say, 50 times further by playing through the time that the rest bonus was accumulating. But, surprisingly, the average player was not a robot (not at that time, at least) and felt better with a totally insignificant boost whenever they next happened to log in than with forgoing sleep.
Considering that changes to SoD tend to be quite conservative, I doubt any rested exp system would ever be anything more than my example. So object to it for what it would be: a feel-good feature that, at best, would occasionally let someone say "I could finish this level/tome if I grind for two more hours, but it's late and I'm tired, and if I take a break now it'll probably only take 1 hour tomorrow, so I guess I'll take a break. How nice."
cian2
Dalayan Master
kinda surprised to see all the fuss about rested exp since it's a pretty minor bandaid at best in my imagined implementation. i think the combination of rested exp and camp bonus from daoc would be a nice start.
for the unfamiliar, camp bonus works like this: the longer a mob of a certain spawn point is alive, the more its bonus exp builds up. when the mob dies, it gives out that bonus exp and goes back to zero. it's almost like a reverse rested exp
for the unfamiliar, camp bonus works like this: the longer a mob of a certain spawn point is alive, the more its bonus exp builds up. when the mob dies, it gives out that bonus exp and goes back to zero. it's almost like a reverse rested exp
Sounds like very unpopular exp zones would get grps again cause of that.