Silosobi
Dalayan Pious Diety
Yes! Zaela makes such amazing things that make the game more fun!
Rogue Dps
- Thread starter fascav
- Start date
Yes! Zaela makes such amazing things that make the game more fun!
Crynel
Dalayan Elder
this is one of the big peeves of that stance i always had. never made sense that i found an opning and struck it it only to have it miss. as for the other ideas they sound like they would help but who knows for sure only testing will tell.
Dimmi
Dalayan Elder
I love the melee ideas....not sure what would have to be done about the throwing thing though, as monks currently trounce rogues on throwing via crippling strikes. The one neat thing about rogue throwing I always loved was the ability to assassinate with a throwing item, but this rarely comes up past...well...EW orcs =(
As far as poisons go, this may be WAY outta the ballpark, but is there a way to activate a poison and have it alter the rogue's weapon temporarily with say X amount of procs of Y poison? If it's even possible I'm sure it would be wonky, especially when it comes to pristine weapons etc.
Personally I prefered the ammo-slot proc thing, because it gave you the ability to quickly and easily control your poisons. One procs, you swap it out for something else while it runs its course (possibly even another poison) without having to click buff slots, equip and click poisons, worry about blocking an incoming short-term buff, etc etc.
Poisons currently seem amazingly unappealing without some way to apply them for free (not taking a buff slot, wasting an equipment slot, etc etc) because they're still stuck at tier 2. Potions would be pretty unappealing if you could only get a 10 pt heal or +10 to one save per pot, etc.
As a bonus option (especially with the creation of higher tier poisons) I think combining the use of poisons to the use of traps would be pretty damn neat. You could slap a poison on (in your buff bar, ammo slot, whatever happens to be the application method nomally) and wait for a proc, or you could use it on a trap you set (or a trap you found? OOOH that excites me...stealing a trap from the environment to use against mobs instead of disarming it with a DC based on set/disarm traps skill!?!?) and add the poison effect at a 100% proc rate on the trap in addition to its usual (lackluster) effect.
On the idea of increasing backstab's efficacy based on timed human reaction, I love it...and if balance vs mashing is touchy, maybe make it add status effects or debuffs instead of extra damage. If you strike during someone else's critical hit the mob gains an AC debuff, if it's during a distraction he gains a small stacking slow effect, during a spell crit it gains a resist debuff based on the spell's type, if during a transition to a new target it gains a movement speed reduction (that bypasses immunity if possible?)
As far as poisons go, this may be WAY outta the ballpark, but is there a way to activate a poison and have it alter the rogue's weapon temporarily with say X amount of procs of Y poison? If it's even possible I'm sure it would be wonky, especially when it comes to pristine weapons etc.
Personally I prefered the ammo-slot proc thing, because it gave you the ability to quickly and easily control your poisons. One procs, you swap it out for something else while it runs its course (possibly even another poison) without having to click buff slots, equip and click poisons, worry about blocking an incoming short-term buff, etc etc.
Poisons currently seem amazingly unappealing without some way to apply them for free (not taking a buff slot, wasting an equipment slot, etc etc) because they're still stuck at tier 2. Potions would be pretty unappealing if you could only get a 10 pt heal or +10 to one save per pot, etc.
As a bonus option (especially with the creation of higher tier poisons) I think combining the use of poisons to the use of traps would be pretty damn neat. You could slap a poison on (in your buff bar, ammo slot, whatever happens to be the application method nomally) and wait for a proc, or you could use it on a trap you set (or a trap you found? OOOH that excites me...stealing a trap from the environment to use against mobs instead of disarming it with a DC based on set/disarm traps skill!?!?) and add the poison effect at a 100% proc rate on the trap in addition to its usual (lackluster) effect.
On the idea of increasing backstab's efficacy based on timed human reaction, I love it...and if balance vs mashing is touchy, maybe make it add status effects or debuffs instead of extra damage. If you strike during someone else's critical hit the mob gains an AC debuff, if it's during a distraction he gains a small stacking slow effect, during a spell crit it gains a resist debuff based on the spell's type, if during a transition to a new target it gains a movement speed reduction (that bypasses immunity if possible?)
Otcho
Dalayan Pious Diety
This killed all hope of the rogue class being remotely fun. Please disobey whoever told you to not do this.
Could be temporary augs.
Yeah i was thinking the same thing, just add a type 30 or something to all rogue usable gear or w/e and make the poison into augs that only rogues can make/use.. excellent idea Zae
darksabbath
Dalayan Master
An aug with a set amount of poison charges perhaps? But then, would you need to carry an aug kit around all the time on the rogue?
darksabbath
Dalayan Master
If the poisons became useful/wanted, then perhaps there will be a reason to finish the system?
Tarutao
Staff Emeritus
*files that in the thin folder labelled "Pottery".
QFT, with minor clarification.
darksabbath
Dalayan Master
Changes to rogue class sound sexy awesome.. except for the lazy button-spammer "I'm watching TV" rogues, I guess.
Otcho
Dalayan Pious Diety
thanks to gerick for reminding me about this thing:
Is it possible to have evade function without having autoattack turned off (pressing hide during combat). I have no idea of the client limitations etc this is just an annoying thing I forgot about after having it macroed for 6 years.
Is it possible to have evade function without having autoattack turned off (pressing hide during combat). I have no idea of the client limitations etc this is just an annoying thing I forgot about after having it macroed for 6 years.
Crynel
Dalayan Elder
did some testing with the "new rogue things" and it seems to work in terms of the messages and the 100% accuracy when an opening happens.
as for the damage of the backstabs themselves....yeahhhh im not sure if its jsut awful luck or odd coding but overall the backstabs done via "sneak attack" seem to either not get the bonus or actualy do the reverse and lower damage done. i opened up my logs and the following is a general view of what i got:
3165, 2953, 3533, 4272, 2452, 3348, 1331, 2887, 8464, 2162, 2835, 2755, 6460, 1528, 5456, 2861, 3058, 3058, 7780, 6564, 1806, 8070, 3991, 1256, 1986, 4170, 1671.
as you can see these numbers seem rather low aside from the few that were over 5k (the 7 and 8k's were insidious stabs). the only explanation is either a bad code somewhere or some sor tof gear error causing the 4.3 poker to not be httign a sahrd as it should be (i doubt the stat patch thing that happened with this had any effect like this but never know)
as for the "got em'" hits i got as folows:
8088 (insid), 2574, 2000, 1547, 4556, 1133, 3502, 1266, 3924, 1044, 907, 1867, 3668, 3138, 1171, 1348, 2183, 3017, 1107, 1107, 2363, 1688, 1951, 2532, 801.
again it seems the BS damage is being reduced somehow which again either points to a bad code or backstabs in general being a bit wonky since patch.
for referance all of this testing was done with reinhardt via crac'tees and river alligators in remnants of old ikild.
as for the damage of the backstabs themselves....yeahhhh im not sure if its jsut awful luck or odd coding but overall the backstabs done via "sneak attack" seem to either not get the bonus or actualy do the reverse and lower damage done. i opened up my logs and the following is a general view of what i got:
3165, 2953, 3533, 4272, 2452, 3348, 1331, 2887, 8464, 2162, 2835, 2755, 6460, 1528, 5456, 2861, 3058, 3058, 7780, 6564, 1806, 8070, 3991, 1256, 1986, 4170, 1671.
as you can see these numbers seem rather low aside from the few that were over 5k (the 7 and 8k's were insidious stabs). the only explanation is either a bad code somewhere or some sor tof gear error causing the 4.3 poker to not be httign a sahrd as it should be (i doubt the stat patch thing that happened with this had any effect like this but never know)
as for the "got em'" hits i got as folows:
8088 (insid), 2574, 2000, 1547, 4556, 1133, 3502, 1266, 3924, 1044, 907, 1867, 3668, 3138, 1171, 1348, 2183, 3017, 1107, 1107, 2363, 1688, 1951, 2532, 801.
again it seems the BS damage is being reduced somehow which again either points to a bad code or backstabs in general being a bit wonky since patch.
for referance all of this testing was done with reinhardt via crac'tees and river alligators in remnants of old ikild.
Give us a long list of your old backstabs (and not just the big ones).
The code is extremely simple for damage. If opening, use the damage it always uses. If sneak attack, use the damage it always uses, then add (damage/4) on top.
Last edited:
luciferblack
Dalayan Elder
These rogue changes sound great. Saw it on the main page and had to come find the thread to say thank you. I now want to play my rogue again.
Seems possible.