To Jyre or not to Jyre, that is my question.

S

Snake

Dalayan Elder
Was not sure where to place this question.

But bascily I'm in doubt if I want to get Jyre or not, on my Warrior (Alpharious).

I belive I understand all the pro's:
DB with AE, DS, Lifetap with aggro, "Dodge" (when worn in main hand). Illusion? I guess its easier to see when your in combat hehe.

The con's I understand what you lose, but not how much you lose...
I'm currently +20%, and would go to -20%, but what does it actually mean?

Here is the wiki info:
http://wiki.shardsofdalaya.com/index.php/Specialization

What I'm fishing for here is, how much of a change in %, will going from +20 to -20 do on the following:
Improves your skill and damage with weapons.
Improves the damage of your damage spells.
Healed amount of your healing spells.

Your combat avoidance.
Your mitigation.
Your ability to resist spells.

Your ability to bypass the resists of enemies.
Your ability to conserve mana on casting.


(Don't personally care for mana conservation, but there are knights out there that might).


Alternatively, if someone can hook me up with Crynel's info, I could try and do massive parses, to find these %'s, but obviously wouldnt be as precise, and there would be many factors that would taint the data, like AC from iksar, #of tomes, and hard to set up same gear.
 
your character gets 3.7% worse overall. Specializations are 10% baseline so you go from 12% to 8%. Jyre on a warrior is definitely worth it though, the only class you could argue its "bad" for is a shadowknight.
 
Let me just give someone crynel info because they asked on the forums... lol. It's broken good on a warrior. How do you think i basically solo healed a t9 geared guild to t13 in a few months ? The big drawback was healing her in exp groups was noticeably harder compared to my own warrior with just a robe, however in 2.5 tanking seems quite over tuned anyway and all the experience mobs ive done so far are incredibly easy to heal. I could never pull 10 bloodfire and heal it with an ancient hot + warrior self healing before 2.5, now I can with ease.

Jyre deathsave is enough of a pro to erase all con of exp tanking without it equiped since you need ae weapons for aggro. If you know you are going to die then you just bloodlust right before that happens and the jyre death proc will heal the warrior to full basically. The amount of additional self healing you get from jyre proc on every hits incredible too.

Boss tanking on a robe + jyre is insane. The warrior only gets hit around 15% of the time overall since the broken amount of ac on robe + the avoidance part of jyre. Without a jyre the warrior gets hit around 22-25%. Which honestly is about how often most people get hit once they get robe. Since the robe is obviously broken and acts as a 550ish? (forgot exactly) ac bp people with them tend to have around 3300-3500 ac it just isnt displayed properly and at that point most characters are almost as equally tanky as eachother, the big difference is that avoidance mechanic on jyre that pushes tanking to dumb levels. Jyre without a robe is way less tanky than just a robe by itself. But combining them just makes what the robe is already doing another step up.

Jyre's single target dps is also great and the additional healing from bloodlust is far superior to scythe + offhand. Monster 2her from a single target dps point is greater than Jyre on a long fight, however the healing is not nearly as smooth as a lot of the damage is based on procs and you lose the avoidance bonus from Jyre obviously so you could argue your boss dps potential is slightly lowered for the asinine amount of additional tanking you can do with Jyre.

It's fire based so you lose out on some of its potential in FR/Emberflow but it's honestly not a game changer compared to what it does tanking raids.

tl;dr You're probably really dumb if you don't get a Jyre on a warrior in the current state of the game.
 
More or less what I had figured Lleoc...
Better on raids. 6 mans about the same. Worse for exp.

Obv situational, like fire immune mobs, a Jyre'd char is just plain worse against, all but the slightly higher DS and a non damage Death save.

Thx feedback, and yeah Sabuti, so far we haven't seen any, and might never do heh.
 
Lleoc said:
words words words
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I've never parsed tanking/avoidance in SoD but did not realize high AC/robed characters only get hit about 25% or so of the time. This makes jyre dodge passive give close to a 70% improvement in overall avoidance (assuming the character naturally only gets hit 25% of the time, and jyre dodge is 10%). Thats even more nuts than I imagined. Knights do not get a similar benefit afaik, as shield block is pretty close to Jyre dodge in terms of avoidance.[/QUOTE]
 
from the looks of this thread they should nerf the 4.3 robe and jyre. you should have have such a huge bonus to a character based on these items.
 
Not sure what you're playing at since you know where that conversation has went, since you know 4.3 robe has been brought up often with devs. Jyre on it's own is nothing special, robe is just broken since the worn spell ac isn't divided by 3 like it would be if it was an actual buff. Jyre is only insanely strong with robe because instead of adding more ac which does very little it adds a flat avoidance number to an already broken amount of mitigation through pure ac numbers.
 
Nebi said:
from the looks of this thread they should nerf the 4.3 robe and jyre. you should have have such a huge bonus to a character based on these items.
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yeah but content like farhags is balanced around 4.3 and jyre tanks with 100 tomes using 2 minute vah backs with old channeling so their lifetaps always crit, doing so would make encounters like folerit UNBEATABLE
 
Folerit is unbeatable, fyi. Stack as much overpowered loot as you can but nobody has ever killed him and gotten into the well.
 
I would wear a jyre if I was still a good paladin geek but that spec hit would give even Templeton an ulcer.
 
Your character goes from roughly 25-27% missed, which is hits mitigated to 0 by ac to 43-45% missed, vs high tier bosses. It is more extreme vs experience mobs since they're lower leveled. Add roughly 25-30% avoidance skills/blocks and you get retardedly tanky. The 4.3 robe needed nerfed way back when it was first brought up, at this point in the game unless actual new tiers of content come out there isn't much point to trying to fix it and just get the 10 remaining players who still play with one to throw a fit and quit.

Jyre is not that great on it's own in regards to adding to a characters overall tanking and that is because of the deity bonus being shit on. Jyre is a lot stronger on warrior than knights because what it is effectively doing is allowing a warrior to do good damage/selfhealing while wearing a shield. That is essentially what the avoidance effect on Jyre does, it gives the warrior avoidance like a shield already does for a knight. Since knights are already wearing a shield to tank, the deity spec hurts them enough that it actually makes them take more damage and not be able to do as much healing/damage as before. It is noticable on a sk and hurts their ability to solo harder mobs. Paladins, however, almost require a Jyre to reduce their reliance on spells to generate aggro and also have no other alternative for dps weapon atm. Without one their dps is just garbage.

Overall the other effects of Jyre affect the classes similar besides the warrior using the deathsave ae to heal themselves while the knights can just self heal anyway so that's not that big of a deal. The weapon overall is imo fairly balanced for what it takes to do. You forever (up until now at least) trade off permanent deity spec which, if the game ever continues, will hurt your character, for a stronger character currently, for 2/3 of the classes who can weild it.

The majority of nerfs that have happened to the fun things in the game seem to have been done on a whim. Some of them have ended up making items stronger in the long run anyway, cella is a good example of this. But the robe is just flat out broken. It's ac does not get divided by 3 like normal spell ac does. If it gets nerfed it would be one of the last things to complain about since it's actually justifiable. However for what my opinion is worth it seems like it's a little too late to change it unless there is new content that needs balanced and it has to be balanced around the one item. At the very least I don't think it is going to get nerfed since it was recently (like a year ago now ?) made to have the same drop rate as any other item the 4.3 encounter drops.

Just my thoughts on the issue, but I'm obviously just a passing stranger and have no impact on whoever is currently in charge / actively working on the game and what they decide to change because one day they wake up in a bad mood.
 
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