Overpowered Items.

I just wanted to say that while I agree with most of what Slaariel is saying in this thread about not spreadsheeting progression, being a shaman, I still think druid thaz legs are ridiculous. I kinda thought armor sets like thaz should be at least kind of equal, but the thaz druid legs are substantially better than the thaz shaman legs in every meaningful way, and have no trade offs.

But I do think that items like the vah tmaps and conscience add something to the game; it's good to have one or two items that are definitive for a class/archetype for a long time. "Epic" items are kind of similar, and as a shaman getting into tier8/9 I think I am going to miss my tal'yan mask.
 
Slagar said:
"Epic" items are kind of similar, and as a shaman getting into tier8/9 I think I am going to miss my tal'yan mask.
Click to expand...

See? Shamen have an item that is class specific and all others envy... the thaz legs are the good items for druids (and they are not THAT big difference to how good a druid heals/buffs/does his job as the mask makes for a shammy)
 
kallemur4 said:
See? Shamen have an item that is class specific and all others envy... the thaz legs are the good items for druids (and they are not THAT big difference to how good a druid heals/buffs/does his job as the mask makes for a shammy)
Click to expand...

The difference is, SHM Mask is the result of a long painfull quest, where druid legs are just a "here, loot this, combine it with some trash drops that conveniently drop in the same zone and call it a day" thing.
 
I always thought there were way too many sidegrades from tier to tier. That there are occasional items to get pretty excited about is not a bad thing imo. and sometimes I think it's not so much that an item is so overpowered as for why it lasts so long, but that there just aren't many other decent options at a particular slot along the way. Focus effects also make some items last longer than they should.
 
kallemur4 said:
See? Shamen have an item that is class specific and all others envy... the thaz legs are the good items for druids (and they are not THAT big difference to how good a druid heals/buffs/does his job as the mask makes for a shammy)
Click to expand...

In addition to what Nwaij said, it's not like druid thaz legs fit the bill as an epic, class defining item anyway. Not only are they simple to get, but like you say the stats don't really make that big a difference in what it is to be a druid, they're just overpowered compared to plainly comparable items.

There aren't many comparable quests to the shaman epic mask, and I wouldn't be complaining about druids, or any other class getting them.

On a related note, while focus effects can be a headache to balance, I think they definitely contribute to making the equipment side of the game more interesting. If it wasn't for focus effects, and other really important things like clickies and worn item effects, the whole game would be just a quantitative progression of AC/HP/Mana, which would get pretty boring pretty fast.
 
Slagar said:
On a related note, while focus effects can be a headache to balance, I think they definitely contribute to making the equipment side of the game more interesting. If it wasn't for focus effects, and other really important things like clickies and worn item effects, the whole game would be just a quantitative progression of AC/HP/Mana, which would get pretty boring pretty fast.
Click to expand...

Oh, I totally agree. I was just pointing out that items that last more than a couple tiers half the time aren't doing so because they're so much crazier than any of the things along the way, but that they might have a heal inc 7 or have one of the only range incs you can find for awhile or something similar. People pass on things that would be pretty huge upgrades because they don't wanna lose a particular focus effect.
 
I also like having awesome items in the game that last a long time. My only complaint is that that some classes tend to get some of these items over the tiers, while others have few/none items that are class only and super awesome. I'm not talking about like thaz gear or spires bracers, but cleric ip hat, war pofrost bracer, bard instruments, etc.
 
Jotigidou said:
I still think that fucking Ballista from Clockwork is too good for the difficulty of the zone/mob.

As far as Tmap gear is concerned, Solo summed it up for me.
Click to expand...

Ballista's not that good is it?
Sure, it's better than the IP bow, but Clockwork is kind of a zone boss and should drop more memorable loot than some crazy/easy dragon in IP, even if they are ostensibly the same tier.
Plus Ballista isn't nearly as good as Mahdi.
 
I think we should just all learn a very important lesson from Zatik crying about Breeches of Antiquity and stop while we're all ahead.
 
Faelus said:
I think we should just all learn a very important lesson from Zatik crying about Breeches of Antiquity and stop while we're all ahead.
Click to expand...

Presenting a reasonable argument that many, including yourself, agreed upon before Zaela had a field day on them.

I still dont' regret it as it ended in one of the funniest things i've seen happen in a long time :D
 
Slagar said:
Ballista's not that good is it?
Sure, it's better than the IP bow, but Clockwork is kind of a zone boss and should drop more memorable loot than some crazy/easy dragon in IP, even if they are ostensibly the same tier.
Plus Ballista isn't nearly as good as Mahdi.
Click to expand...

Mahdi got implemented after a lot of whining on a couple of rangers part... * cough * . It's actually somewhat recent.

I'm not taking any credit , devs did a good job implementing the item but yeah.

You have to think about how much more trouble Plane of Fire is compared to Rust. They should lower the damage / delay a TINY bit and up the stats just follow with the bow progression.

Right now it's just a huge-ass-hitting crossbow with nothing else. But it's still huge-ass-hitting.

Dragons in IP are definitely not super hard, but getting there does take a lot of time. And getting to Clockwork is not hard at all.


Honestly I really could not care that much about balancing ranger bows, I'm just more concerned because I used to main one.
 
hey magina i was thinking about going to a nearby hospital and telling all the old people they will die soon, you should join me, i think you'd be pro at it.
 
Nuvian said:
hey magina i was thinking about going to a nearby hospital and telling all the old people they will die soon, you should join me, i think you'd be pro at it.
Click to expand...

I actually am. I don't want to go down there and show you up though, it's kinda your thing.

That said, I honestly think having one ultra bitch thread for items may be a better idea than having 1,000 single threads.
 
One of the drawbacks to hand-tailored itemization (vice cookie-cutter spreadsheet style like Live or WoW) is that items will occasionally not fit a perfect balance to where they came from. Holgresh Elder Beads were a good example of it on Live.

But here's the thing... the game got a LOT more boring when they did switch to that method, and extremely few items "break the mold" in either game. This makes getting drops moot beyond stat upgrades, which is horribly dull compared to occasionally finding something ridiculously awesome for where you got it.

I vastly prefer the hand-tailored method. It's part of the allure of an emu server. If it really is obviously over the top they can always change it.
 
Xelris said:
One of the drawbacks to hand-tailored itemization (vice cookie-cutter spreadsheet style like Live or WoW) is that items will occasionally not fit a perfect balance to where they came from. Holgresh Elder Beads were a good example of it on Live.

But here's the thing... the game got a LOT more boring when they did switch to that method, and extremely few items "break the mold" in either game. This makes getting drops moot beyond stat upgrades, which is horribly dull compared to occasionally finding something ridiculously awesome for where you got it.

I vastly prefer the hand-tailored method. It's part of the allure of an emu server. If it really is obviously over the top they can always change it.
Click to expand...

it is one thing to prefer hand-tailored, it's another to say that there isn't some tweaking that can be done to a number of silly items
 
ya, but where do you draw the line?
My vote is for even more capricious itemization. Random IS loots from trash mobs in under used xp zones. Obscure quest pieces from t10+ encounters. Archaic frags dropping from random npcs in athica. That would make the game much more alluring and less boring.
Also, more frequent complete reworking of items a la the recent breeches of antiquity fiasco.
 
I personally like this idea as well, killing trash is, generally, a chore no one relishes. Having random, cool, absurdly rare stuff come from it gives a grinder that voice in the back of their head saying "the next thing you skip could drop your dream item, why stop?" which seems good for a game looking to have people, yaknow, playing. Make it no drop to prevent random bursts of getting half a charm from selling a drop. I would, personally, avoid any sort of utility/off-class clicky type of thing to prevent the "must farm or I'm underpowered" mentality.

This sort of thing was part of what made Diablo-style itemization so exciting- part of the allure in SoD for me is the unpredictability, lack of documentation, and the benefits of exploration. I can only see "epic" drops adding to this.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom