NPC Complete Heals

vistachiri said:
Sekrit plague priest stratz!

If you have good resists, or can heal yourself somehow, root him. He'll burn all his mana on nuking you. When he stops. Blow him up.
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A better strat would be to just avoid them or to single pull them.

There is really no reason you should have 2 plague priests running around healing eachother with you doing damage, it's just dumb. Single them out, avoid them, or let them nuke themselves oom.
 
iaeolan said:
A better strat would be to just avoid them or to single pull them.

There is really no reason you should have 2 plague priests running around healing eachother with you doing damage, it's just dumb. Single them out, avoid them, or let them nuke themselves oom.
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:psyduck: I am talking about having one. Not 2, where the hell you got 2 from I'm not sure.
 
vistachiri said:
:psyduck: I am talking about having one. Not 2, where the hell you got 2 from I'm not sure.
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brasileira said:
The heals on the priests in plaguelands are pretty dumb..
i cant bow kite twice at same time.. =/ one heal each other to full
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I don't see any reason why npcs should be able to chain a 2.5 sec cast time CH. PCs can't do it, when they could it was 10 sec, and 2.5 sec is very difficult to interrupt - which in many cases is the only strat you can try to have a chance at beating the mob.

This thread is not solely about plague priests - even though some mobs like Plague Priests can be worked around, it still doesn't make sense, and it can make some encounters very unbalanced given the change.
 

Ahh gotcha, no they heal themselves to full as well easily enough. Back when it took a bit to cast cheal stuns actually had a chance in hell of working. Nowadays gg that mob is healing itself until it's mana is gone. 1 is enough of a pain as it is, I've never been stupid enough to go for 2 at once and think it was a good idea.

Allielyn said:
I don't see any reason why npcs should be able to chain a 2.5 sec cast time CH. PCs can't do it, when they could it was 10 sec, and 2.5 sec is very difficult to interrupt - which in many cases is the only strat you can try to have a chance at beating the mob.

This thread is not solely about plague priests - even though some mobs like Plague Priests can be worked around, it still doesn't make sense, and it can make some encounters very unbalanced given the change.
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Yep quite a few.
 
Regardless of what my plague priest posts may allude to, I have always thought NPCs should be on the same timer as PCs for CH.
 
i think that the ch for npcs should be set to a 10 sec ch instead of the same thing as players. if a mob can only ch one time per 10 mins.. that will kinda take away a bit of challange. yea you have to kill it twice basically but you dont really need to worry about stunning it.. just bring enough heals and dps and tada... during raiding lazuli for example.. not a hard mob really.. but with the continual heals, at 10 sec cast time, made the fight long and hard if the stuns werent going well.. if lazuli casts once.. and doesnt heal anymore.. pushover for sure=/ faralak, i cant remember this one real well, but i believe theres 2 elementals that heal him... obv u can cast stun spells on them but you cant attack/kill them.. if they had a 10 min recast then they would both blow their heals in 1 cast... i dont recal if they are spaced on when they cast, i believe they just cast around 50% or so... whereas if we put it back to the original cheal.. its the same fights they use to be.. which i think worked just fine... gives time to do stuns.. gives them ability to cast more than once a fight.(well aware most has been said just thought id agree)

as far as smaller mobs go.. yea.. best thing to do is root em and let em nuke away... if you cant heal.. your probably wasting your time(assuming we are talking level 45+ mobs.)
 
khador said:
i think that the ch for npcs should be set to a 10 sec ch instead of the same thing as players. if a mob can only ch one time per 10 mins.. that will kinda take away a bit of challange. yea you have to kill it twice basically but you dont really need to worry about stunning it.. just bring enough heals and dps and tada... during raiding lazuli for example.. not a hard mob really.. but with the continual heals, at 10 sec cast time, made the fight long and hard if the stuns werent going well.. if lazuli casts once.. and doesnt heal anymore.. pushover for sure=/ faralak, i cant remember this one real well, but i believe theres 2 elementals that heal him... obv u can cast stun spells on them but you cant attack/kill them.. if they had a 10 min recast then they would both blow their heals in 1 cast... i dont recal if they are spaced on when they cast, i believe they just cast around 50% or so... whereas if we put it back to the original cheal.. its the same fights they use to be.. which i think worked just fine... gives time to do stuns.. gives them ability to cast more than once a fight.(well aware most has been said just thought id agree)

as far as smaller mobs go.. yea.. best thing to do is root em and let em nuke away... if you cant heal.. your probably wasting your time(assuming we are talking level 45+ mobs.)
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Faralak isn't impossible under 2.0 for sure though. Empire did him fairly often, and I'm sure other guilds have followed suit and done so as well. You need 2 people who can stun (bard for one works mad crazy well) but they need to be lucky and bring their A game so to speak. Lazuli on the other hand when she was waaay below our tier lasted freaking forever. I think we just said to hell with this and massported out after like the 10th cheal or so.
 
indeed. lazuli would have went down if we had more dps to out parse its heals. i endorse the idea of balancing this Ch problem out.

Keirga
 
neodiahs said:
indeed. lazuli would have went down if we had more dps to out parse its heals. i endorse the idea of balancing this Ch problem out.

Keirga
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Pretty much, think we had 10ish or so, and were there and draxx was like I could use that bag, and we hopped over and said yeah sure we can do zirvane, how hard could this be?
 
iaeolan said:
Regardless of what my plague priest posts may allude to, I have always thought NPCs should be on the same timer as PCs for CH.
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By this logic, then players should be on the same level for HP as npc's. Which mean MT's should have 100,000hp+.

Mobs, by default, cannot be like players, there is tuning required . I have never met a mob that CH's so much he cannot be defeated (and if you can't beat them then gear up, level up, aa up, and get better so you can.) Priests in PL's suck, but they are easy enough for me to solo 2 or 3 in a row. Taking that into consideration, I'm not a brand new level 65 with crappy gear, but most the server isnt, and if you are then don't try to solo a mob that CH's. Raid mobs don't CH over and over. I don't know, if the jist of the argument is "some mobs are hard to solo cause they heal"..then wiz would probably take away their CH ability, adds 2000 mana, and give them fast heals. Either way you're fucked. Get a group that can kill mobs that heal. :psyduck:
 
iaeolan said:
You should direct this at the person who has trouble with them :tinfoil:
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I'm directing the comment at the person who is bitching about how it is unfair that NPC's can do something PC's cant.
 
Tomil said:
I'm directing the comment at the person who is bitching about how it is unfair that NPC's can do something PC's cant.
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I was just pointing out how I have thought that NPCs should be on the same CH timer after the CH change. I never said NPCs should share the same stats or anything else. A CH for an NPC doubles the encounter time and is a heal for tens and hundreds of thousands of hitpoints opposed to the PC 10kish max. Let's not jump to conclusions.
 
Steel was dicking around in Kedge to get the Plane of Water port spell tonight, and the deepspawns CH the hell out of each other. It's not an instant cast, but there's next to no time to react to the casting of their spell with a stun of your own.

We had a bard mezzing two of them, and fighting a third one. Granted, bard mez is not as effective as Enchanter mez, but it got the job done. Anyway, when mezzes broke, the one we were fighting got healed nearly to full, when they were only awake for 10-15 seconds on average. Quite obviously, Tasradur of the Depths is quite below Steel's tier, and we had some problems with the mobs CHing.

It wasn't really a big deal for us, but for a lower-tiered guild which might not have Enchanter Relic Mez, the encounter might prove to be impossible if things don't go perfectly right.
 
Draxx said:
Steel was dicking around in Kedge to get the Plane of Water port spell tonight, and the deepspawns CH the hell out of each other. It's not an instant cast, but there's next to no time to react to the casting of their spell with a stun of your own.

We had a bard mezzing two of them, and fighting a third one. Granted, bard mez is not as effective as Enchanter mez, but it got the job done. Anyway, when mezzes broke, the one we were fighting got healed nearly to full, when they were only awake for 10-15 seconds on average. Quite obviously, Tasradur of the Depths is quite below Steel's tier, and we had some problems with the mobs CHing.

It wasn't really a big deal for us, but for a lower-tiered guild which might not have Enchanter Relic Mez, the encounter might prove to be impossible if things don't go perfectly right.
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Not to get off topic on deepspawns, but Ponden and I 4 char'd them today without a problem, no mez or stuns at all.
 
Mythryn said:
Not to get off topic on deepspawns, but Ponden and I 4 char'd them today without a problem, no mez or stuns at all.
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Well yeah, I was just using them as an example of how CH can quickly get out of hand when you're fighting mobs that have the ability to do it.

If no one fucks up then you're golden.
 
Bumpish...

I think this idea is the exact meaning of "balancing". I have not done any high end raiding on this server, but I can see how some encounters might be a pain in the ass because of this and I definitely know that in xp groups cleric mobs are just annoying. This is not the reason to change something. The reason to change this is because it would balance the way PCs and NPCs cast the exact same spell.

To put it in a nerdy perspective, this is just like a DM/GM saying you cannot use spell X or feat Y, but then letting an NPC use said spell or feat. Nerfing/modifying something because you feel it is imbalanced is fine, but please make the change on both sides. It is just kind of silly to have the NPCs use the same spell at a more broken level.

Felyn
 
I could be wrong, but I can really only assume that this was an unintended consequence of the CH changes - as such it still doesn't make sense and makes for some difficult fights.

Have the NPCs chain quick heal or "relic" heal or some such, or allow them 1 x quick CH - but remove the ability for NPCs to chain quich CH's.
 
Is there a way to make the NPC cast times be revamped to 5-10 second cast times? This would allow more time to get off that crucial stun and complete the counter as intended instead of waiting for a CH mob to go oom. I vaguely remeber Wiz talking about some things cannot be added and this might be one of those things, hopefully not.
 
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