Fix Bow Progression Statting

The reason Mahdi is not is not an upgrade is because its hella fast. With haste capped, as it usually is between GoE and /s 2 and bard songs (if the fight allows it) you want the slower bow, for the bigger hits and crits. The way giantkin works now it MIGHT be a bit bigger benefit to Mahdi, but im pretty sure its about even on that front. Probably gives a bigger % increase in DPS but the same raw amount of DPS between the two bows.

If mahdi is meant to fill the space between ballista and UC/Flarewynd, its a poor choice. Give it the same delay and a slightly higher dmg number, or at least a much closer delay and keep the same better ratio, and you've got yourself a deal.
 
Dimmi said:
I'm still holding to the Mahdi being the saviour of us all (badum-tchsh)

Aeternus had Maysun loot (according to the wiki) from pofire before we'd even finished off valor B, without doing a hellishly long clear of pofire

Dare I say....without killing Maysun even once....

Hello Kalila:
http://shardsofdalaya.com/fomelo/fomelo.php?char=zawrlith

This thread is getting nasty fast, and the arguement I keep seeing is:
I don't want the same item everyone else has, but I don't want to kill different mobs from everyone else because it takes too much effort

vs

Welcome to SoD, that's how raiding works

I even posted a bow that's in game that I'm pretty sure you can obtain from 2 different encounters in a T6-7 zone. You said put a new bow just like Mahdi in pofrost b/c nobody kills pofrost, then said Mahdi doesn't count b/c nobody kills pofire, then said Mahdi was a downgrade from the clockwork bow despite being better in literally every way aside from being like 25 range shorter. I am confuzzled.
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Dimmi, you know people kill PoFrost.. ALOT more than PoFire. And now that Thaz has been revamped, I think it would also be a good opportunity to insert something in there.

Let's be realistic here. Please. What bow do all rangers use ? Fucking Starmetal Ballista. It's just how it is. It's not a matter of being different. It's a matter of transition to Flarewynd/Branch.

Yes I agree, The bow I wear right now, is decent. Ballista too... BUT. You don't get that lack of bow itemization in low tiers, there's plenty of options in zones, albeit more zones yes I admit. But it's just tedious, and really unnecessary to have the Best Bow on Clockwork before having to jump into a HIGH tier 9, Tier 10 mob to get another one in a zone that takes a 5 hours clear.

I just feel like there's a gap to fill in-between. Am I seriously the only one who thinks that ?
 
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kibeth said:
The reason Mahdi is not is not an upgrade is because its hella fast. With haste capped, as it usually is between GoE and /s 2 and bard songs (if the fight allows it) you want the slower bow, for the bigger hits and crits. The way giantkin works now it MIGHT be a bit bigger benefit to Mahdi, but im pretty sure its about even on that front. Probably gives a bigger % increase in DPS but the same raw amount of DPS between the two bows.

If mahdi is meant to fill the space between ballista and UC/Flarewynd, its a poor choice. Give it the same delay and a slightly higher dmg number, or at least a much closer delay and keep the same better ratio, and you've got yourself a deal.
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Exactly. If Mahdi would have stats close to Starmetal, then I could see why guild would go there for Rangers. But as of now, it will simply NOT happen, it's a VERY poor choice. :)
 
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NeoReloaded said:
T0-T6: Kedgemetal Crossbow or Soul Seeker (the BoE one from The Deepshade or w/e the fuck the zone was called). Swiftshot is also a good choice.
T5-T7: You get Crossbow of Tenacity from Valor, Misery from Torment.
T7-T8: oshittt moar bows!! Woe from Yashira, Bloodseeker from Ritualist in CoD, Clockwork bow.
T9-T10: You have the UC bow, or Flarewynd.
T10-T11: You get Masalavir.
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Actually I retract my previous statement. This looks pretty legit. I agree w/ the stat issue though.
 
NeoReloaded said:
Foley used a Kedgemetal bow until he got the Clockwork one. After that, I snagged Woe from a random Yashira raid to use during CC-dependant fights. Honestly, this is bow progression:

T0-T6: Kedgemetal Crossbow or Soul Seeker (the BoE one from The Deepshade or w/e the fuck the zone was called). Swiftshot is also a good choice.
T5-T7: You get Crossbow of Tenacity from Valor, Misery from Torment. Woe from Yashira, Bloodseeker from Ritualist in CoD, Clockwork bow.
T8-T9: oshittt moar bows!!
T9-T10: You have the UC bow, or Flarewynd.
T10-T11: You get Masalavir.

Srsly, you can probably use the Clockwork bow until you get Masalavir. it's a rilly gud bow brah
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Fixed.
 
Clockwork is indeed tier7, and of the bow droppers is pretty much the easiest. And drops the best bow.

And if you cross me again fool ima personally leave my pimp ass fishing trip, got it son?
 
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I don't know about you guys but i'm thinking that perhaps the Devs are avoiding this topic for a reason.... maybe this entire issue is 100% resolved somewhere in the coming weeks with ikisith's release. I'm thinkin you made a big enough stink, i'm almost positive they've read through and seen all of your points in your arguments so be patient and see what happens as far as seeking a tier 8 bow. the progressive stating however is an issue that has been avoided like 17 times.
 
Which is kinda lame. Rangers make a thread, rogues get buffed and the ranger concerns are looked at like we're all crazy
 
I know ikisith is coming so that might fix this problem, although im not sure anything being released is tier8 or equivalent. I don't expect the Devs to jump up and be like OMG you're right we've missed this all along, how could we?? but I would at least like an admittance that maybe once the first wave of ikisith is out that stats on bows will be reconsidered (ratios are fine pretty much except for mahdi and the entropy bow seem to be really fast, making them poor bows).
 
I thought the original intent, and the only thing I care about, is rethinking the stat process of bows to be more like a range item and less like a weapon. Or closer to how a 2h weapon is stat wise.
 
Zaela said:
Serizus is supposed to be how hard an Upper Thaz boss ought to have been (lol).

Can someone restate what exactly this thread is asking for with bows? I skimmed it and am seeing like 3 separate and/or vaguely defined things.
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And if serizus is how hard upper thaz should have been, i think you just blew my mind.
 
A couple more bows would not hurt... I was actually talking about that 30 minutes ago with a guildy.


There are some very decent bows for T4-7 ranges ...the transition from ValorA bow and Clockwork is kinda okay. The thing is... AFAIK, it's the only potent one. After that you are stuck downgrading your ratio for a slightly better bow all around coming from a mob at least the same difficulty as generals which are T10 ( Branch of Conquering legacies ) or farming for 6 months to get Flarewynd... Obviously Masalavir is out of question but yeah.

Was pretty curious to know if that was the intentions of the Devs as far as weapon progression is concerned with ranger range abilities.



Regards

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What do you think of bow availability and progression between Tier7-9 ? I made a relatively long post in the earlier pages about it...

EDIT : Personally I think you could insert one or two that are in between Starmetal Ballista and the retarded one to get from Serizus Blacktongue and have some kind of balance.

Like a cold theme based bow in Pofrost would probably be viable.


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It's hard to gobble up loot tables on mobs that are already not being raided or accounted for.

Most of PoFrost is that way, which is why I think my suggestion is still, and will be viable unless Ikisith has a few tricks in his bag.

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Yeah that would fix this whole issue too.

The thing is, for guild that are progressing through T7-8-9 content, there really is no alternative beside the Ballista from Clockwork.

Flarewynd is hell to get because some of the things to get are almost never up.

And The bow from Serizus... Well Serizus is no pushover. You told me he's not that hard but really, even with a proper strat you need to be clutch and have very good tanks/ mob control. And that's without even talking about getting to him.

If you're progressing through Thaz / PoFrost / lower ToT / first 2-3 named in UC, i think there should be an option among these. Most of the ranger on the server use that stupid ballista lol.

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I was vaguely aware of its existence, but knowing how fun Plane Of Fire is ( I PERSONALLY don't have anything against it ) , and the fact that it is a downgrade from ballista on a Tier7 mob that is rarely taken out ( i'm not sure about the state of plane of fire but I heard it takes a damn while to clear some parts )... I don't think it's a viable option. There is a lack of Bow(s) on Tier8 mobs.

Again, you can just look at the fact that 80 % + of the rangers in mid-high progression guild are using the same tool. /sadface
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Sorry about UC you are wrong:

Welcoming commitee
Primalist
Leech Lord
Ganlak
Barrel ( optional like you said )

Then comes Serizus

He's not on par with fahranniath, fahranniath is garbage compared to him. The strat is harder to figure out, harder to pull off, and the mob in general is harder because of the clock ticking on him for the most part. Farhanniath is just the combination of all the other farfags put together.

That is not even considering ganlak, who is not a pushover himself because you need T9 + tanks and some insane DPS for a part of the fight.

I have no Bias, i'll have the Branch eventually. You sir are full of shit if you call me bias for trying to have empathy for other rangers.
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Dimmi, you know people kill PoFrost.. ALOT more than PoFire. And now that Thaz has been revamped, I think it would also be a good opportunity to insert something in there.

Let's be realistic here. Please. What bow do all rangers use ? Fucking Starmetal Ballista. It's just how it is. It's not a matter of being different. It's a matter of transition to Flarewynd/Branch.

Yes I agree, The bow I wear right now, is decent. Ballista too... BUT. You don't get that lack of bow itemization in low tiers, there's plenty of options in zones, albeit more zones yes I admit. But it's just tedious, and really unnecessary to have the Best Bow on Clockwork before having to jump into a HIGH tier 9, Tier 10 mob to get another one in a zone that takes a 5 hours clear.

I just feel like there's a gap to fill in-between. Am I seriously the only one who thinks that ?



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Résumé : Serizus is not easy, actually pretty fucking hard. Clockwork is retardedly easy. Every ranger uses his stupid bow. People proposed plane of fire bow, but it's pretty shitty compared to clockwork bow / not worth the clear.

People keep blabbering about Serizus being on par with Fahranniath, which is IMO and Opinioned with some other people : Total bullshit.

Flarewynd is hell to get, like seriously hell.

There should be a transition between Clockwork bow and Serizus because that leaves an almost 3 Tier gap between 2 bows.

Wala.
 
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Oh hello wall of text. What was the point of that?

Heres what won't happen: existing mobs having a bow added to them.

Heres what might be possible: a rethinking of how stats are put on bows, making them more in line with range items at the same tier (i wouldnt expect the stats to match of course but the distance between range items and bows stat wise is horrifying when you look at the resists and raw hp/ac you give up)
 
kibeth said:
Oh hello wall of text. What was the point of that?

Heres what won't happen: existing mobs having a bow added to them.

Heres what might be possible: a rethinking of how stats are put on bows, making them more in line with range items at the same tier (i wouldnt expect the stats to match of course but the distance between range items and bows stat wise is horrifying when you look at the resists and raw hp/ac you give up)
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Ask me if I care ? I adressed a serious issue. If i don't get responded on it, well fuck it.

Like I said, I won't be the one who's gonna be BSed by it...
 
why not just add a bow to a mob rarely taken down like the attendant of the heart in frost, or th maysun rida in PoFire. IF either one of them dropped a bow guilds might go out of there way to raid it for there ranger.
 
ngl, i prefer Woe over Ballista

kibeth said:
Clockwork is indeed tier7, and of the bow droppers is pretty much the easiest. And drops the best bow.

And if you cross me again fool ima personally leave my pimp ass fishing trip, got it son?
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deeeng, i did not mean to cross you homes :(

ps lets play starcraft.
 
Lockon97 said:
why not just add a bow to a mob rarely taken down like the attendant of the heart in frost, or th maysun rida in PoFire. IF either one of them dropped a bow guilds might go out of there way to raid it for there ranger.
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Are you serious? I'm 100% sure you aren't aware that Maysun Rida ALREADY drops a bow. It's called Mahdi. While it has decent stats, its ratio is 68/44, which is incredibly fast. You'll burn up your nice arrows on boss fights way too quickly and once haste is fully applied you'll start losing in the DPS race against a slower bow even if the ratio on Mahdi is better.

Personally I feel like the newer additions to tier8 (Praetors in HMal) should have had a bow added onto their loot tables.
 
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