Current SoD

[Expletus]

Lets have a serious discussion as to if anything can "save" Shards of Dalaya. Not making this topic to flame or start a war of any kind im just a HUGE fan of the content here and would love to see the server thriving again.

Myself and a few other friends come back every few months and try to get into the server but the population is what keeps us away, hell i have even recruited some people from Project1999 that end up loving the server but when they reach max level they find out pretty quickly that there is no one to group with.

Now i know alot of people are hoping that with the 3.0 launch, and the server gets added to the eqemulator login that a alot of players will come running to the server, while yes this may be true do you really believe that 90% of the people who play on eqemu know nothing about SoD?

Lets say 3.0 launches and Shards of Dalaya's Population breaks 600 active players on a daily basis (could be more, this is just an example). In the servers current state most players if not all will just level to max buy Bind of Equip gear and jump straight into a T5+ raiding guild. There will be no reason to kill pre T5 raid targets even with newer players thus making the middle - higher tier raids more contested.

Time VS Rewards, Over the years we have seen plat and experience nerfed in pretty much every conceivable
way. Cesspits is probably the best example of what a zone should be as it offers new players an area that gives decents rewards and money for the time invested. Generally this only gets worse as you continue to level up in SoD.

The Bounty System, Great concept but poorly executed. What this should be is a system to were newer players can farm bounty tokens and make themselves a full set of starter gear (55-65), This way when they get to the max level they would have a solid footing on the server and the current playerbase would feel more inclind to include them in there exp groups, pugs, etc.

So what can be done to save the server? How do we make the server more new player friendly? There has to be some way we can draw in players and keep them playing. Hopefully the staff is open to suggestions and we can finally start the healing process and get our playerbase back up.

Now don't get me wrong, I LOVE SOD, THE SERVER NEEDS TO THRIVE, IT NEEDS A BIGGER POPULATION!!! IT DESERVES BETTER THEN THIS.........

 

[Draeos]

I made a post once about how if we made it past 400+ people we'd never actually make it to 400+ people because there is no room in the raid/6 man game for that many active guilds.

 

[Breigon]

I made a post once about how if we made it past 400+ people we'd never actually make it to 400+ people because there is no room in the raid/6 man game for that many active guilds.

Solution to that problem: Instances.

 

[Hesyous]

When I started ....in 2011, early in the year. I swear at peak times I saw 300+. That was nice....ALL level ranges 1 - 65 had constant xp groups running, raids were thriving, but I admit the only thing available was tier 1 to 3 mobs. That's back when FWF were rocking everything up top....tier 13 or whatever it was. Honestly not to discredit other guilds, I just didn't pay attention much to any guilds. I was just after the game experience which is wonderful.

Right now....my major issue is not having anyone to group with below 65. Literally finding a xp group under 65 is rediculously hard. I am boxing right now and....xp goes slow in a 2 man group. Yes, Breigon is right about the 'instances'. That would fix the 6 man. But if we did get over 400 player base, regularly, the upper tier raiding would ....it would hurt. upper...lol, all raiding would hurt. Unless you were in a guild that could grab stuff fast and keep a time and date of when a repop is going to occur, good luck being a successful raiding guild.

 

[Yale1]

The game is old. Your "group" of people that still have interest in this type of game is small. The game is even smaller because it basically only caters to one type of player. That leaves a very small audience. When I started playing 400 -500 people online was fairly common, the numbers have dropped every year. Simply put, the entire problem with the game is that the game runs people off. Don't have time or the ability to raid? Bye. Whole life not based on knowing when a mob will spawn, having the strat and no job in the way of your playing time? bye. Don't have high tier raid gear on your character making farming money a breeze rather then a painful experience? Bye. Not to be rude, but to be honest, I'm surprised the game is still around with this setup, its truly outrageous. Very few people in normal situations can justify playing this game.

If you want to get more people the game needs to cater to different types of players. period. This is beating your head against a wall and wondering why it hurts, its that obvious.

Yale

 

[donfolstar3]

Yale hit the nail on the head with many of those point. Some recent changes to SoD like patches that address things people are clamoring for, graphics, looming 2.5, and the PAD forum are great, but more could be done. The primary problem facing sod is population and there are plenty of game changes that could potentially (1) attract people to SoD, (2) encourage players to be more welcoming of new players, (3) make the transition into the meat of the game less painful.

Problem: XP is slow, how unattractive.
Yeah, yeah "faster than original EQ" or whatever, but compared to most modern (and by modern I mean in the last decade) game leveling/AA/tomes on SoD is offensively slow. Some will cite the irrational concern that players would lose interest if they hit an xp cap which again is not the case in most modern mmorpgs.
Possible Solutions:
1. Server wide xp bonus based on server funds. Just to spitball some %s correlating to the 5 lights on the mainpage: -10, 10, 20, 40, 80. Added bonus of encouraging players to donate.
2. Create a tome like item which does nothing, but is part of a repeatable quest for plat once filled. There, the cap "problem" is solved forever. No more tinfoiling.

Problem: Being welcomed into groups/raids
ooc is too damn quiet. Fresh 65s are often seen as a burden. Chances are that right now in OG, Rust, etc... there is someone boxing (probably with a character that belongs to someone who hasn't played in years) alone while people are LFG. Here are some things that might gently encourage people to stop being antisocial weirdos.
Possible Solutions:
1. Change group xp to increase as more people are in group. Right now 2-6 players receive the same xp which offers no incentive to drag a newb to work. Again, spitballing, but something like 5% bonus for each person past 2. Added bonus of helping with slow xp.
2. Give raid mobs a % chance to drop an additional item based on the number of people in raid. More spitballing- something like 0% up to 12 then increases to around 50% at 18. Now filling out your pug (or poorly attended guild raid) with less than optimal players is appealing and newbs can do the happy dance. Added bonus of making the raid grind less grindy in general.

Problem: Gearing for the meat
Ding 65- Grats! Now lets hope you had detailed knowledge of the item opportunities the whole way to 65 or chances are you have shit gear and nobody likes you. Maybe you'll get lucky and tell a whimsical joke or perform a riviting jig that gets you into a raiding guild, but chances are you have a life of bounties and tmaps and buying gear ahead of you to still be fairly shit geared by standards.
Possible Solutions:
1. Add bounty rewards and increase the number of bounties (3/2/1) that can be done per day. It seems to me that coming up with ideas for more bounties would be an excellent use of the PAD forums.
2. Make low tier (<4) raid drops xpable. Realistically those items, for the most part, could double in stats and still be inferior to BoE ikisith items. That or change the T1-3 world mobs into lvl 55-59 adepts. Increasing the size of the kiddy pool gives new people a chance to learn to swim.
3. Make Ragarati a 55 adept. Seriously what kind of sick mind said "hey lets make this big quest for an awesome item and, knowing that people have characters stopped at 55 and that is a thing people do, make the last step involve the lvl 52 adept." These are the kind of dick moves that turn players away.
4. It was once said that it would be possible for cmal to drop only class armors usable for people in the zone. Maybe I dreamed that, but if this is the case then do it already!
5. The drops on D-tmaps kind of suck. This is a minor point, but every little bit helps.

---
TLDR; how about make SoD more fun (leveling and gear is the core of fun, admit it) and social since it is a MMO game?

 

[Nwaij]

2. Give raid mobs a % chance to drop an additional item based on the number of people in raid. More spitballing- something like 0% up to 12 then increases to around 50% at 18. Now filling out your pug (or poorly attended guild raid) with less than optimal players is appealing and newbs can do the happy dance. Added bonus of making the raid grind less grindy in general.

This allready exists in a way. Search for "Fortune favours the diverse".

 

[darksabbath]

Just a few comments to add, but yeah, I agree.

Problem: XP is slow, how unattractive.
Yeah, yeah "faster than original EQ" or whatever, but compared to most modern (and by modern I mean in the last decade) game leveling/AA/tomes on SoD is offensively slow.

Actually, Exp here might be quicker than what live originally had, but live is far quicker than SoD these days. You have to compete with today's market, not the one of 15 years ago.

2. Make low tier (<4) raid drops xpable. Realistically those items, for the most part, could double in stats and still be inferior to BoE ikisith items. That or change the T1-3 world mobs into lvl 55-59 adepts. Increasing the size of the kiddy pool gives new people a chance to learn to swim.

I like the idea of making the drops xpable, that could certainly help out. I could understand maybe making T1, and maybe some T2, into max lvl 60 adepts. Some of the T2/3 mobs have relic chances, And I don't support handing those out on adepts.

3. Make Ragarati a 55 adept. Seriously what kind of sick mind said "hey lets make this big quest for an awesome item and, knowing that people have characters stopped at 55 and that is a thing people do, make the last step involve the lvl 52 adept." These are the kind of dick moves that turn players away.

Make an alternate final path for those over level 52 instead. like hail him, and he explains how he takes his orders from some named in Meilc, perhaps Mielech himself!

4. It was once said that it would be possible for cmal to drop only class armors usable for people in the zone. Maybe I dreamed that, but if this is the case then do it already!

Oh, that would be so awesome. Gets irritating getting drops for classes that aren't there.

5. The drops on D-tmaps kind of suck. This is a minor point, but every little bit helps.

There is a few decent pieces, but most only do them for the tmap quest and the dark elf clicky ring I think. A large part of that is that you can buy better items for less trouble than the d-maps are to do. The penchant of getting the same drop(s) 5 maps in a row does not help.

 

[Hesyous]

Good posts!

I'd like to point out...some of the my frustrations with this game yet, I still play. This is my luck regarding Eldritch Scroll drops. Seriously, it's stupid! I get invited to go snipe a mob with whoever. I am told which is...awesome, I'll get the scroll drop because no one else needs it. WOOO ME! Guess what hasn't dropped? I think about 6 times now...yep, no scroll. No Relic spells for me. I am really getting tired of being stuck in this rut. It seriously is pissing me off...and sometimes I truely feel like playing something else.

I am a platinum donator, and I do not donate to get the ....what I think personally, crappy little bonuses in game. I do it to help out because I really like the game. However, personally I'd like to see some freebees (not the ones I currently get, something more, something better) or xp bonus for all my chars on ALL my accounts.

Also, I am one of those family guys who does NOT have the time to play this game 5 to 8 hours dedicated time a day. So....honestly I'd pay for damn relics if I could. I am not rich either but if I can see some kind of progress other than AAs that would be cool. But I think I am just barking up a tree with my dreams...

 

[CharmCitysKing]

"Nothing gold can stay"

-Frost

 

[Zaela]

<serious = "off">

I think the server has pretty much run its course. Was an interesting experiment in directionless growth, but there's nowhere left to take it that's worth taking along all the built up baggage.

I don't see the client upgrade making much difference population-wise. Maybe a brief spike, but nothing lasting. The quality of life improvements would be nice, but hardly game-changing. New weapon models, NPC models and zones would be nice, but I don't think there's anyone left with both the time and the drive to make anything of significance with them. Expanding one or two concepts and fiddling with some numbers is not likely to change that, either.

I've said it before, but there isn't enough room for meaningful rewards outside of raids. With (almost) all items competing directly with each other, the equation is inevitably weighted toward raid items. If an item from a quest or a dungeon is too close to a raid item relative to the "difficulty" of gathering 10-18 people together for hours day after day and week after week to climb the tiers, well, it's hard to justify putting it in. On the other hand, making items and content that don't appeal to the most vocal players -- the ones that do play day after day and week after week raiding -- that's not great either. When you make stuff, you naturally want to hear what people think. I've said it somewhere else, but with the experience of trying to work under that, my ideal server today would have rewards from different content "streams" separated out completely rather than competing with each other (via standardized aug slots and such) so that the raid stream does not dominate all the more casual-friendly streams. Maybe even give the casual streams more weight than the raid ones -- so a player can get far doing dungeons and quests and tmap-type things, but one who does all that and raids will always be a little stronger, just not overwhelmingly so. People already cheese and 6-man low-end raid content when they're higher-end; might as well make that an intended progression point for less raid-oriented people as they get strong via dungeons and quests. Blah blah blah. I don't think there's room for any of that in SoD, though.

 

[Gawain]

I've had the thought for many months the server has two years left before it dies from decay; I'd be surprised if 50 people online at peak hours when that time comes. For reasons already listed I think this game is too discouraging to keep new people both from the leveling up experience, the realization of what has to be done when you're 65, and the way many players treat others on a low population server.

Edit addon: I do not feel the server has the physical space to keep 300 toons entertained anymore due to how strong characters have become.

 

[donfolstar3]

The last three posts are probably correct. At the risk of repeating what has already been said and dumbing down things here is my take on the real core problems with SoD:

1. Over emphasis on raiding. Raiding was originally a way for developers to do less work to please more people. I am hard pressed to think of any good fantasy epic where small armies of heroes go around ganging up on baddies. Raiding is a huge time sink which makes sense when you are selling subscriptions, but quickly turns into a time sink that most productive members of society simply cannot abide. Making raiding the icing of character development as Zaela suggested, instead of the top 8 layers of meat, would be a much better design for building more balanced and enjoyable game.

2. Scaling. Quick question: how many lvl 1s would it take to win in a fight against [insert top5 character of choice]? How many lvl 50s? How many fresh 65s? The answer to all of those is "too many". Even Conan lost fights when hopelessly outnumbered (like 10 to 1, not the infinity + 1 lvl1s it would take to beat Bango) With ridiculous scaling like that content cannot not be trivialized and the playing field is so skewed toward time invested that most new people took one look and said "no thanks" years and years ago.

3. Boxing. Even the limited boxing SoD adopted as part of being stuck with a antiquated template really kicks character balancing and adventure right in the pants. That most classes, as badass adventurers, would be lucky to win one on one battles without cheesy techniques for most of their progression gets back to the idea of good fantasy epics listed under 1. Remember that sweet scene in LOTR when Hidalgo and Short Comic Relief had to team up to slay a lone scrawny gnoll? No? Oh right, because that isn't heroic or epic or even remotely makes sense. The fallback of boxing and expecting groups for just about everything really screws with player v world scaling and making well rounded classes that would stand a snowballs chance of surviving in a, umm, real fantasy world.

That said SoD does some things right that modern MMOs have thoroughly fucked up:

1. Emptiness. Go run around the Badlands and what will you see? Not a goddamn thing unless you know where to look. The real world is like that fairly often as well. Now run across WoW or GW2 or ESO (probably) and what will you see? Some goddamn goblins jumping out to attack you every 10 meters, almost on a grid. That isn't fun or immersive or "realistic", just a bunch of shit thrown on the screen. Even in "the Barrens" on WoW you could usually see 5-10 monsters from any given location. What do they eat? How is the entire world not covered in a thick layer of shit? (or is it- ha!)

2. Class envy. While SoD might have a few too many classes (thirteen. thirteen classes is the right number. trust me?) most classes do a really good job at something that when you see it gives you raging class envy unlike many newer games where you are all doing the same shit with a different graphic or name or whatever. Clerics clicking a button to save an entire raid? Knights surviving a big pull when the healer LDs? Wizards and Rangers casually sitting in the back making big numbers happen? That shit is rad.

3. I need more beer and am not going to proofread any of this.

 

[Latten]

Good posts!

I'd like to point out...some of the my frustrations with this game yet, I still play. This is my luck regarding Eldritch Scroll drops. Seriously, it's stupid! I get invited to go snipe a mob with whoever. I am told which is...awesome, I'll get the scroll drop because no one else needs it. WOOO ME! Guess what hasn't dropped? I think about 6 times now...yep, no scroll. No Relic spells for me. I am really getting tired of being stuck in this rut. It seriously is pissing me off...and sometimes I truely feel like playing something else.

I am a platinum donator, and I do not donate to get the ....what I think personally, crappy little bonuses in game. I do it to help out because I really like the game. However, personally I'd like to see some freebees (not the ones I currently get, something more, something better) or xp bonus for all my chars on ALL my accounts.

Also, I am one of those family guys who does NOT have the time to play this game 5 to 8 hours dedicated time a day. So....honestly I'd pay for damn relics if I could. I am not rich either but if I can see some kind of progress other than AAs that would be cool. But I think I am just barking up a tree with my dreams...

So you killed 6 mobs that might dropps relics and you got screwed ? So your solution that thoose mob or mobs should have 100% dropp rate ? Go do your pug go raid PoT , Powater etc kill few mobs and relics will dropp.

Instances would be cool to implent in eflow and most tier 10+ zones.

 

[Shouki]

Personally, I LOVE SoD! I've try to show my appreciation for the work done through donations and I hope the server is around for years to come.

My opinion is if anything it's just a matter of keeping new players coming in as with any other game. I see lots of comments similar to "this game is too old school for the modern gamer" yet I look over and see 800 people on P1999. Is that game new school? I know it really caters to those that love the old EQ game, I'm one of them, but I chose SoD because I got old EQ feel, with new and IMO improved content and lore.

Many of the other complaints about finding groups, which leads to finding gear and stuff go away with population as well.

The rest of the ideas seem to delve into the casual vs hardcore gamer thing. I've been on both ends of the spectrum over the years. I just don't think SoD has a problem for casual gamers unless you think casual players must be able to beat SoD not only casually but quickly. A fresh 65 has tmaps, quest gear, tradeskill gear, BOE, PUGS, bounties, and more that can get any part timer to mid tier casually which opens you up to participating and surviving mid upper tier stuff. Also, if you are even somewhat friendly and don't totally suck you are bound to run into friendly higher tier players who are more than happy to help you. It just takes a casual more time which is part of the whole "being casual" concept.

Thanks to everyone that's help put in their time and resources into this game. I always try to remember these folks have built a game for whatever their own reasons which didn't include being paid for their time. That's what I find the most amazing thing about this server. Maybe I'm just easy to please. Thanks!

 

[Daffie]

I totally wish I had more time to play SoD because this is a really great game.
I'm at the point in the game where I can't just jump in and play for an hour. Anything I want to do in order to progress my main characters is a multiple hour per session investment (or a raid.) I'm older than a lot of other players here, and frankly, I can't find the time to give that many hours at one sitting.

I've camped my paladin heal spell for 60+ hours with some camps being 10+ hours straight. I've done maybe 30+ hours in remnants looking for my shaman's haste item. Other camps I've done for items have been similar. I just don't have the time to progress like that anymore. I do enjoy the game and need to win the lotto so I can play all the time...

Edit - I should add that I am not complaining (maybe about the stupid heal spell...) I am just pointing out that gamers are aging, and don't have the time they once had.

 

[Ulandx]

Myself and a few other friends come back every few months and try to get into the server but the population is what keeps us away, hell i have even recruited some people from Project1999 that end up loving the server but when they reach max level they find out pretty quickly that there is no one to group with.

I can find a group or at least someone to play with any time of day,even at 6 am (est) morning with 20 players on.
... with my 65s.
The low population seems to be more a problem of the lower levels,even the 55 game is dead now,Traek/Pounders
up for weeks,and certainly quite frustrating for new players to be unable to kill Ragarati to finish the ring quest.

So what can be done to save the server? How do we make the server more new player friendly? There has to be some way we can draw in players and keep them playing. Hopefully the staff is open to suggestions and we can finally start the healing process and get our playerbase back up.

They added tons of newbie quests lately,and you could always box,only way to make it even more newbie friendly would be
to let new players start at 65.
I think its not so much SoD's fault but the masses being dumb and prefere to play their instant reward/item shop games.

Don't have high tier raid gear on your character making farming money a breeze rather then a painful experience?
Yale

My 55 Box paid for the larger part of the 225k charm on my Cleric.

there is someone boxing (probably with a character that belongs to someone who hasn't played in years) alone while people are LFG.

Now that issue IS a fault of SoD,driving fresh 65s away.

Problem: XP is slow, how unattractive.

I never understood this,doesnt matter if you kill in Warpstone/Kaladim/HLrobots,Sorc's/Eld's or BQ,the basic gameplay is
very similar at all levels,if you dont enjoy Warpstone you probably wont like BQ any better,so how fast you gain xp isnt
really that important.

I'd like to point out...some of the my frustrations with this game yet, I still play. This is my luck regarding Eldritch Scroll drops. Seriously, it's stupid! I get invited to go snipe a mob with whoever. I am told which is...awesome, I'll get the scroll drop because no one else needs it. WOOO ME! Guess what hasn't dropped? I think about 6 times now...yep, no scroll. No Relic spells for me. I am really getting tired of being stuck in this rut. It seriously is pissing me off...and sometimes I truely feel like playing something else.

Have the same issue with "Confines of the rushing stream"
Camped it hard for almost a year,meaning avarage 5 days a week,2 or 3 hours,some days more than 1 session,lately I found the OG ring
quest being the same ,some quests items seem to never drop(razor lotus).
This certainly made me play less the last months.

 

[Valv]

High tier people don't want to group with lower tier people because money becomes much more valuable then exp. If i can duo and clear all of kae lib before repops what do I gain from bringing more people? A little more exp but its cost me pp every time someone else joins. I'm much closer to finishing tomes than I am to finishing the charm farm. Needing 16 junk tomes or paying 10-20k for tomes+ their bind cost on top of needing to save up 1.2mil pp is the real grind and a big reason people are antisocial. If a full grp could get more exp and make more cash people would grp up but that's just not how it works. Someone under t7 will add very little to a grp but still take a cut of the cash so why invite them?

This is a game that requires working with other people but offers a lot of incentive to not do so. Bad game design.

Leeching, lack of new content, playing ringers that the owner hasn't played in years, the grind, the lack of things to do when you finish the grind, ect ect.

 

[Waldoff]

High tier people don't want to group with lower tier people because money becomes much more valuable then exp. If i can duo and clear all of kae lib before repops what do I gain from bringing more people? A little more exp but its cost me pp every time someone else joins. I'm much closer to finishing tomes than I am to finishing the charm farm. Needing 16 junk tomes or paying 10-20k for tomes+ their bind cost on top of needing to save up 1.2mil pp is the real grind and a big reason people are antisocial. If a full grp could get more exp and make more cash people would grp up but that's just not how it works. Someone under t7 will add very little to a grp but still take a cut of the cash so why invite them?

This is a game that requires working with other people but offers a lot of incentive to not do so. Bad game design.

Leeching, lack of new content, playing ringers that the owner hasn't played in years, the grind, the lack of things to do when you finish the grind, ect ect.

A long time ago, we experimented with a system where if a group killed a named placeholder, it would have a higher chance of popping the named on respawn. It basically skewed the percentages more in favor of the rarer spawn. I wonder if this, as well as maybe some modifier to raw plat drops, could be something worth considering.

 

[enasc]

High tier people don't want to group with lower tier people because money becomes much more valuable then exp..

High tier people care about platinums? Maybe I'm grouping with the wrong high tier people (or maybe it's the right ones), but we would rather bring along real people than boxes when doing xp. Pretty much every time.

Could we each 2-box and keep Kaesora library down? Yeah, probably. But that's work. And I don't want to work while xping. I would rather relax and kill some monsters with friends. Maybe make some new friends while we're at it.