3rd Enchanter tome

Clammie said:
what would you suggest then to keep chanters playing?
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im going to be honest and say duoing/soloing is awful as an enchanter compared to other classes and i dont think people would disagree. They are gross in raid/6 man though which balance wise and thematically makes sense. A class tome isnt going to fix that, unlesss it made charm pets under a certain level do significantly more dps
 
I would agree with that. What would you suggest to keep the chanters around then? To help with the duoing problem. I completely agree they are a sick class and very useful in alot of group/raid things.
 
I box pal/enc and I am perfectly happy with enc as it is. Yes enc is very strong in larger groups but weak when alone or with just one or two others in all but a very select few situations. This is okay. It's a class that thrives in groups and I wouldn't change anything. Well, minus cascading bond(I would make it, you know, cascade onto the enc as a recourse). Or I would change the name. It's very confusing.
 
Another suggestion for 3rd enchanter tome:

Display the length of the charm when the initial charm is casted. There was a bug I assume for a few weeks where this actually happened for chanters by default, similar to enhanced control, but for any charm. But seeing as the functionality already exists to display the charm length to the chanter, it wouldn't be that much development effort maybe.

Not sure what the other ranks of this tome could be but maybe other stuff that effects/enhances charms. Haven't given the other ranks much thought.
Rank 1: Charms resist rate -15%
Rank 2: Display charm duration to the enchanter.
Rank 3: Increase charm duration by 15%.
Rank 4: Charm pet damage increased by 15%.
 
Pecannius said:
Another suggestion for 3rd enchanter tome:

Display the length of the charm when the initial charm is casted. There was a bug I assume for a few weeks where this actually happened for chanters by default, similar to enhanced control, but for any charm. But seeing as the functionality already exists to display the charm length to the chanter, it wouldn't be that much development effort maybe.

Not sure what the other ranks of this tome could be but maybe other stuff that effects/enhances charms. Haven't given the other ranks much thought.
Rank 1: Charms resist rate -15%
Rank 2: Display charm duration to the enchanter.
Rank 3: Increase charm duration by 15%.
Rank 4: Charm pet damage increased by 15%.
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rank 3/4 seem like the only worthwhile ranks, the first 2 are kind of bad tbh
 
Tevinter said:
Enchanter Tome Idea: Guardian Angelmation/True Guardian(RIP True Giant)/Animated Rune/Secrets of the Enchanter Folk/
The enchanters Animation has a 3/6/9/12% chance to sacrifice itself to save the enchanter from a fatal blow, similar to Wee Folk tome. It could even have a cool emote that everyone can see to let them know your pet is a true hero.
"Meowmix is destroyed as it guards Tevinter from a fatal blow!"

Gives the Enchanter pet more utility along the lines of the Guardian Animation AA.



Alternative Idea
Animated Shield/Animated Protection/Meowmix the Martyr/Magical Efficiency/Mana Shield
When the enchanters animation dies, the enchanter is shielded for 150/300/450/600 Magical damage. Nifty emote could go along with it.
"You gather the mana from your animation to shield yourself!

Gives the Enchanter pet more utility, and makes the pet useful for when it inevitably dies from its pathetic amount of hit points.

Its really late and these ideas/tome names may not be very well thought out, will post more whenever I roll out of bed
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from the last thread about books.

also for third enchanter tome we could consider

Tears of the Beguiler (AKA tears of the crusader mana edition)
Mana Fountain (gather mana returns 1.5/3/4.5/6% mana to the enchanters group)



a hilariously overpowered, just for funsies idea

Manual of Magnificent Mimicry
rank 1 - somatic bond now applies to both the enchanter and his/her target
rank 2 - somatic bond now gives a chance to flurry
rank 3 - avatar of destruction now has a spell proc (5% per 100 mana, 75 base unresistable damage)
rank 4 - avatar of destruction now mimics healing spells
 
If people like the idea of improving charm, what about a tome that just makes charm permanent?
Rank 1 works on max charm level minus 3
Rank 2 works on max charm level minus 2
Rank 3 works on max charm level minus 1
Rank 4 works on all charms.

This would be more convenience than power, since it is already possible to know the duration of charm (just test it one time on a given mob, it will always last the same duration). When I played an enchanter in zones with charm-worthy mobs, I always just figured out my timer, and when it was about to break, you start casting relic mez, break pet mid cast, land mez, re charm, break pet mez with that clicky. You can also Enhance Duration long enough to last for any/all encounters in the game.

In practice it would add power, since a lot of enchanters just don't use mez even in places where it has huge potential, and a "guarantee" where they don't have to set a timer or mess with mezzing the pet and stuff would definitely mean it got used more.
 
charm doesn't always last the same duration, it can be partially resisted, which is why most people don't bother with it.
As an enchanter, I would give my left nut to have a permanent charm. As a non enchanter I would scream and cry how enchanters are strong enough as is without that
 
charm is already really really good and the only reason i dont do it more is because i am a lazy person. Murderers in FR, Beyondlings in kaesora, lashmasters in EF, skeles in citadel are all pretty sick pets that do some ballin damage. Permanent charm would just be dumb and take away all of the risk to go with the huge reward of charm.
 
taosanterior said:
charm doesn't always last the same duration, it can be partially resisted, which is why most people don't bother with it.
As an enchanter, I would give my left nut to have a permanent charm. As a non enchanter I would scream and cry how enchanters are strong enough as is without that
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It always lasts the same time on a given target. At least in my ~10 hours of playing an enchanter in charm zones that was the case. Its very easy and safe to keep a charmed pet, its just tedious, and you have to set a timer, which I'm sure gets old.
 
Silosobi said:
It always lasts the same time on a given target. At least in my ~10 hours of playing an enchanter in charm zones that was the case. Its very easy and safe to keep a charmed pet, its just tedious, and you have to set a timer, which I'm sure gets old.
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Let me assure you that your observation is wrong and charm can be partially resisted.
 
Nwaij said:
Let me assure you that your observation is wrong and charm can be partially resisted.
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Maybe I was targeting mobs with low resists? I only have much experience in two zones, but in both of those, I could charm a mob, see how long it lasted, and each time after that charm lasted the same amount of time and it was just a matter of setting a timer to break/mez/refresh.

If charm can partially resist what does that do to enhanced control? Because I always see enhanced buff to about the same duration and it never beaks early.
 
Silosobi said:
It always lasts the same time on a given target. At least in my ~10 hours of playing an enchanter in charm zones that was the case. Its very easy and safe to keep a charmed pet, its just tedious, and you have to set a timer, which I'm sure gets old.
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Thanks for the coaching but I've played much more enchanter than you have and I'm 1000% sure that it can get partialled. Sometimes you enhance a pet and you still only get 2 minutes because the original charm was resisted and only lasts 1 minute. You wouldn't normally know that until it breaks and you die though.

This is the reason that keeping a charm pet is annoying. Recasting charm every 8-9 minutes is easy. Dying every half hour because you get a partial resist and your cleric is busy putting his thumb up his ass is less fun
 
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taosanterior said:
Dying every half hour because you get a partial resist and your cleric is busy putting his thumb up his ass is less fun!
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HAHAHAHA! But yeah, charm can totally get partial resists. Ask anyone who runs abyss with a pet. And as much as I like the idea of a charm tome, there is no real way to change how charm works and be both creative and balanced within the limitations of the game as it is . Making charm last longer, be unresistable, or work on higher level mobs not only has the potential to trivialize a lot of content [across raid, six man, and exp zones], it also does nothing new for the flavor of the class. Enhanced Control is already a thing, so I don't see how we can (reasonably) do much more than that with a tome.

What I'd really like to see is some sort of work with other aspects of the enchanter class - a rune oriented stance would probably be ideal.
DodoBot said:
Here's a few ideas I've kicked around here:

Rune Channeling:
Gives the enchanter a stance with moderate stamina drain. While the stance is active, improves the runes cast by the enchanter. Options on this include chance for increased absorbance. Absorption of spell damage. Flat AC provided on top of the regular rune buff. Faster casting of runes, etc.

Frenzied Animation:
Dramatically increases the animation pet's hp, atk, ac, and attack speed as long as it has somatic bond up on it. Could give an additional SB target and provide a little more flavor to the pets which rapidly diminish in power once you start raiding. Ranks could potentially offer more stats or cool proc options. All ranks also increase the base defensive stats of the animation w/o SB casts.

Simulacrum:
Gives the enchanter an exhaustive stance which upon activating shadowsteps him away and drops all agro. A clone of the enchanter spawns in his place which can fight alongside him for the duration of the stance. Each rank could provide successively more hps, spell abilities, or lower stamina reduction.

I feel like all of these fit with the spirit of the class without being redundant with existing spells, tomes, or focus effects. They could be a lot of fun, provided they were balanced appropriately.
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DodoBot said:
HAHAHAHA! But yeah, charm can totally get partial resists. Ask anyone who runs abyss with a pet. And as much as I like the idea of a charm tome, there is no real way to change how charm works and be both creative and balanced within the limitations of the game as it is . Making charm last longer, be unresistable, or work on higher level mobs not only has the potential to trivialize a lot of content [across raid, six man, and exp zones], it also does nothing new for the flavor of the class. Enhanced Control is already a thing, so I don't see how we can (reasonably) do much more than that with a tome.
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I agree for the most part except for my comment below and why I resurrected this thread.

Pecannius said:
Another suggestion for 3rd enchanter tome:

Display the length of the charm when the initial charm is casted. There was a bug I assume for a few weeks where this actually happened for chanters by default, similar to enhanced control, but for any charm. But seeing as the functionality already exists to display the charm length to the chanter, it wouldn't be that much development effort maybe.
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Knowing the charm duration wouldn't make charming that much less tedious but it would give the enchanter a little more control. Or heck, if knowing the timer too silly a mechanic to be added into a tome, maybe incorporate it into a chanter AA or just make this mechanic standard. My 2cp.
 
Pecannius said:
I agree for the most part except for my comment below and why I resurrected this thread.
Knowing the charm duration wouldn't make charming that much less tedious but it would give the enchanter a little more control. Or heck, if knowing the timer too silly a mechanic to be added into a tome, maybe incorporate it into a chanter AA or just make this mechanic standard. My 2cp.
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I see what you're saying, though I don't think it works for a four-ranked class tome. Perhaps it could be done with a quested one-off item or tome - something like the shaman slow quest [Tylazik's Remains Quest -> The Spirit of the Swarm], or alternatively, it could be added to Advanced Foe Management from Emberflow. It is a nice idea, and this isn't totally game breaking, and I don't even think you want four ranks to do this.
 
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