Warrior Stance Changes

[Gawain]

Can we get official numbers on mitigation and +Agro for the Living Shield and Unyielding warrior stances?

Also, the official numbers from pre-change on those same stances? Particularly with Living Shield, it's hard to measure agro change, especially from a previously barely touched stance.

Edit: My quick duration test (Sihala's + Empower buffed, out of combat):
Living Shield lasted 49 seconds.
Unyielding lasted 3 minutes 36 seconds.

Bothered to buff Acumen as well and sit through again. So now with Acumen, Empower, and Sihala's Regen on:
Living Shield lasted 54 seconds
Unyielding lasted 4 minutes 10 seconds.

 

[Sateru]

Also paladin stances please. Probably doesn't need it's own thread. As of right now /s 4 is pretty worthless.

 

[Waldoff]

Not until finalized.

 

[kibeth]

Also paladin stances please. Probably doesn't need it's own thread. As of right now /s 4 is pretty worthless.

That post failed on SOOOOOOO many levels I don't even know where to begin. You obviously posted this reply with no regard to the thread located directly below it in this sub-forum. Please read about paladins and their /s 4 before you post statements like that.

 

[Sateru]

That post failed on SOOOOOOO many levels I don't even know where to begin. You obviously posted this reply with no regard to the thread located directly below it in this sub-forum. Please read about paladins and their /s 4 before you post statements like that.

You obviously posted this reply with no regard to the nerf that just went in. Guaring Blade has been changed since that thread was posted. You could begin by not trolling this sub-forum.

 

[Vartenaal]

damn that drains stamina fast, even with ancient regen. loved the cute lil comment when i first tried it though "vartenaal gets ready to post angry comments on sod boards". id say this drains stamina at least 3 times faster than it did before. ill refrain from further comments until later, but id like to request that when this is finalized old and new numbers for +hate/parry and stamina drain be posted.

 

[Vartenaal]

Also paladin stances please. Probably doesn't need it's own thread. As of right now /s 4 is pretty worthless.

also about this, ill say it again, paladins are TANKS, not melee dps. /s 4, although SEVERELY nerfed, still increases your hate/parry and thus your TANKing ability. /s 3 doesnt drain stamina, so even a brief boost to your tanking is welcome. if youre not tanking as a paladin, youre not doing your job and using /s 5 for crits is something you generally dont do. this change will affect grouping more than raiding, especially low level grouping because /s 4 was pretty damn sweet. the best stance we have id say. but when you dont have fearless and other aas/gear /s 4 is especially nice.

 

[Waldoff]

the best stance we have id say. .

The best stance anyone had. Looking at the numbers made my head spin.

 

[Sateru]

also about this, ill say it again, paladins are TANKS, not melee dps. /s 4, although SEVERELY nerfed, still increases your hate/parry and thus your TANKing ability. /s 3 doesnt drain stamina, so even a brief boost to your tanking is welcome. if youre not tanking as a paladin, youre not doing your job and using /s 5 for crits is something you generally dont do. this change will affect grouping more than raiding, especially low level grouping because /s 4 was pretty damn sweet. the best stance we have id say. but when you dont have fearless and other aas/gear /s 4 is especially nice.

What i'm saying is that as of right now the sta drain on it make's it only good for emergencies and the start of fights. Extra agro at the beginning or mitigation before the mob is slowed. It drained me in less than a minute. This would be fine imo if paladins got another decent stance. But as of right now it's just /s 4 and /s 3. I really think paladin stances in general need to be looked at.

 

[Manguadi]

What i'm saying is that as of right now the sta drain on it make's it only good for emergencies and the start of fights. Extra agro at the beginning or mitigation before the mob is slowed. It drained me in less than a minute. This would be fine imo if paladins got another decent stance. But as of right now it's just /s 4 and /s 3. I really think paladin stances in general need to be looked at.

It's comparable to the duration of the best shadowknight tanking stance now, and it still makes a greater difference.

I don't think paladin stances in general are a huge concern due to the enormous number of abilities and choices available to a paladin already. A paladin can do enough with heals and aggro to not need stances to give them versatility.

 

[Sateru]

It's comparable to the duration of the best shadowknight tanking stance now, and it still makes a greater difference.

I don't think paladin stances in general are a huge concern due to the enormous number of abilities and choices available to a paladin already. A paladin can do enough with heals and aggro to not need stances to give them versatility.

Just tested this and it lasts about half the time of SK /s 6.

 

[Vartenaal]

What i'm saying is that as of right now the sta drain on it make's it only good for emergencies and the start of fights. Extra agro at the beginning or mitigation before the mob is slowed. It drained me in less than a minute. This would be fine imo if paladins got another decent stance. But as of right now it's just /s 4 and /s 3. I really think paladin stances in general need to be looked at.

yes, the sta drain is INTENSE, which makes me wish that recovery gave some sta regen, but oh well, its not finalized yet, and hopefully Woldaff will stop looking at the numbers so he doesnt have nightmares and maybe if not increase the +hate/parry bonus, but at least reduce the stamina drainage. but overall id have to agree with manguadi. paladins are versatile enough. if you want to pick it apart stance by stance:

/s 4 - now its situational, but still nice.
/s 5 - increase crits stance - just as awesome as it was before, especially if stacked with aa/gear
/s 6 - anti-mez/charm - for this i have to ask, is the Efreeti Thralherd mez in emberflow intended to penetrate this stance? seems odd imo
/s 7 - ae agro proc - sucks big time, doesnt proc often, drains sta fast
/s 8 - situational but fun 7500 dmg in one hit

combine all that with the rest of the stuff we get, id say its fine as it is.

another Q for devs though, max skill cap is 275, if my parry is +25, does this stance allow me to go overcap on the parry?

 

[Kirin Folken]

So if I can trust what was posted here...

Paladins went from 8 minute stance (with Acumen style buff) to less then 1 minute??

Sounds rather harsh.... guess I'll find out first hand later today when I log in.

 

[tinkaa]

So if I can trust what was posted here...

Paladins went from 8 minute stance (with Acumen style buff) to less then 1 minute??

Sounds rather harsh.... guess I'll find out first hand later today when I log in.

If it's still 4 times better than the sk stance that lasts less than 3 minutes, it's fine!
Thanks, Zae, for parsing this.

 

[Vartenaal]

The style looks at your actual chance to parry based on your Parry skill, and multiplies that chance. The skill value itself never changes.

ahh, kk thanks for infos

 

[Maethorr]

The thing is the nerfed it to be in line with the sk stance. Now if you want a longer duration to match the sk stance they can nerf the effect so that its about the same as what the sk stance does. Honestly it lasted way to long before and I think it might be better overall if they made it the same amount of mitigation/parry as the sk stance with a similar drain that would pretty much stop the bitching.

 

[Mythryn]

I think it might be better overall if they made it the same amount of mitigation/parry as the sk stance with a similar drain that would pretty much stop the bitching.

I would bitch, because SKs are supposed to be better tanks than Paladins, with a better tanking style. That's the way it finally stands now.

 

[Cinn]

I would bitch, because SKs are supposed to be better tanks than Paladins, with a better tanking style. That's the way it finally stands now.

Mega bolding this.

Paladins have been ridiculously overpowered and Shadowknights laughingly underwhelming for a very long time now.

I still think Shadowknights need some more love.

 

[Sateru]

The thing is the nerfed it to be in line with the sk stance. Now if you want a longer duration to match the sk stance they can nerf the effect so that its about the same as what the sk stance does. Honestly it lasted way to long before and I think it might be better overall if they made it the same amount of mitigation/parry as the sk stance with a similar drain that would pretty much stop the bitching.

I wouldn't mind our stance falling in line with the SK stance if we got any other decent stances. If i remember correctly the other stances they get are pretty useful. And as vart posted earlier the other stances we get are really not that useful.

 

[Salarus]

Yea, so regarding /s 4, this is kinda rediculous imo. My understanding is that the parry effect got nerfed, as it should have, and the duration decreased. I logged on my pally to try it out, and now the duration is shorter than a parapalegic gnome.

Seriously though, I think a bump in duration wouldn't be too much to ask, keep it still under that of an sk's, but more than it is now.