Taraztu's Infernal Trap

Yup, I am the worst wizard ever. :toot:

Stop IGNORING the resist mod on the spell.

And as far as names go, I think you are whiner and said as much, thats all I said. You however have been flat out nasty. Its not shitting up your thread when people differ in opinion and show you why, which I did and you also choose to ignore that. 20 hours isnt bad, if in fact it was 20 hours and not an exaggeration for a -50 resist mod nuke that does more damage then your lvl 60 staple nuke and its Ancient counterpart.

Dont tell me to make points just so you can ignore them...like these...

It is more dmg and is more efficient then Lure of Ice but has much longer recast and much lesser resist mod.......fine tradeoffs when dmg is needed NOW on non insanely resistant mobs and you can get it 3 levels earlier.

It has more damage then Soloist, is less efficient, but with a stronger resist mod and much longer recast......fine tradeoffs and you can get it three levels sooner.

It has more damage then Ancient, is less efficient, but with a stronger resist mod and much longer recast....fine tradeoffs tho not as attractive due to the Ancient being an ancient...still...3 levels.


And if the fight is too hard for the spell level, then make that your argument, but the spell is quite decent as is imo.

I am well aware of the recasts of all these spells, yes I called the recasts on the anc/solo shitty, just cause the recast on this spell is longer it dosent change that, but it wasnt the point at any rate.

Your arguments go from...... but look at this neat pally spell.........omg im gonna get summoned and it scares me.....20 hours isnt worth 100dmg (even tho im gonna close my eyes and ignore the pimp ass resist mod)....but its not a good as an Ancient spell.

Which is why I said initially to put the spell back to its original form. Then you would know what a crappy spell is, and currently.....its far from crappy.

If you wish to toss any more insults, do it in game and to my face so I can nuke you and your weak ass arguments into oblivion. I have no idea how to play a wizard so hey, you may win!
But heres a protip.....when dueling me, you may wanna use a spell with a decent resist mod ............GUESS WHICH I WOULD SUGGEST YOU TRY FIRST!!!!!



Safiya
 
Syalara said:
words words words
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The fact is the level is a moot point as discussed before and I am no longer going to back track. The resist mod is nice yes, I agree. But the spell still lacks luster which keeps it off my spell bar on many many fights. The reason for this is I can drain my entire mana bar on nearly every boss fights using higher efficiency spells w/ the resist mod in mind/


This post isnt about a specific fight. Its about the utility overall. I called u a retard b/c u are thinking im crying when im opening the discussion about a spell and you think this is a great opportunity to call people names or say negative things.

What you should do is write proficiently and be constructive. There is no need to repeat yourself multiple times in your post going on and on about how you can get the spell 3 levels before ancient, thats just a waste of time to read not to mention confusing as to the point your making. In short, if you disagree, state so. Don't be like "quit crying about something" when nobody is crying. Maybe that will help your arguments be more credible to me, but as of now the only point you make is that the resist mod is nice. That resist mod doesn't make up for the overall efficiency in comparison to other spells.
 
Why would you expect it to be on your spell bar every fight? Its situational.

Overall utility has 0 bearing on situational spells....see RRR. But even so, In a few planes, this spell belongs glued in your spell bar. I would have killed three babies and a poodle to have had this spell when I was doing PoT, 5 min recast or not, notsospecial efficiency or not. I would even add it in my lineup in more then a handful of encounters in my tier.......cause of its efficiency? Newp. For the resist mod.

Keep in mind the Wizard Archaic only rocks a -20 resist mod.

Seriously, its a solid spell as is guy, im sorry you cant see that. Making it cost 25m less or reduce its cast time by .5 is just splitting hairs imo and has 0 effect on the value of the spell either way.



BTW- Just the fact that you mentioned how long it took you to camp it = whining/crying. RNG cant be held accountable for your shit luck as the next wizard may get the spell in less then 10 minutes....that wont make the spell itself any better or worse. Should the next wizard post 100 dmg does = 10 minutes like you equated it to your 20 hour camp?? See what I mean? You may not agree with me but I am sure you can see where I am coming from.
 
BTW- Just the fact that you mentioned how long it took you to camp it = whining/crying. RNG cant be held accountable for your shit luck as the next wizard may get the spell in less then 10 minutes....that wont make the spell itself any better or worse. Should the next wizard post 100 dmg does = 10 minutes like you equated it to your 20 hour camp?? See what I mean? You may not agree with me but I am sure you can see where I am coming from.
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Mentioning what it takes to get an item, especially when arguing for a change to it is absolutely necessary. The camp for the item should definitely be related to how good it is, no matter what you think. Since players don't have access to the loot code to see PRECISELY how often an item is coded to drop, the time it took to camp it is the only indicator we have. I don't know why that is complicated to you or worth dragging out a stupid argument over two pages though.
 
stope21 said:
It took me roughly 20 hours to camp this, with a group of raid geared toons. 20 hours is not worth 100 more dmg.
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Read what he wrote. Read what I wrote.

He is saying the spell isnt good enough for him considering it took him 20 hours to camp it. Thats not a reason to improve a spell. Its not even a point. That does not mean it will take everyone 20 hours. Do you understand what the RNG is? Should the spell be improved because a sample size of ONE was reported to take 20 hours?

By that notion, all Wizard Archaics should be improved based on Nwaijs's shit luck


Speaking of dragging out an argument...you posted here why?
 
Man that's a thread I was agreeing with Safiya :dance:
Unfortunately the recast time makes our arguements totally out. It seems logical, now it's been mentioned, that it shares the long recast of Healing Flames ; but hell 5mn is long for a wizard I suppose. And gem slots are limited; specially once you have concussion / harvest spells loaded...I suppose something could be done to help a bit on this , but it sounded just fine without the recast problem :/ Seriously dude that was more of an arguement, along with difficulty to get it, that "I camped it x hours" or "look at the pally spell ! it bites !".

PS : nice HATE guys , very entertaining. Call everyone for the duel !
 
Speaking of the camp time...i've done that camp with pallies and wizards...spent over 100 actual hours there, never seen anyting drop other than the rogue mask. So if anyting, Stope got lucky by getting it in only 20 hours, not to mention if he thinks the 20 hours was not even worth it, and its going to take most wizards more than 20 hours to get it..saying the camp time is definatly required imo. Flaming and name calling is not =)
 
Magina said:
Speaking of the camp time...i've done that camp with pallies and wizards...spent over 100 actual hours there, never seen anyting drop other than the rogue mask. So if anyting, Stope got lucky by getting it in only 20 hours, not to mention if he thinks the 20 hours was not even worth it, and its going to take most wizards more than 20 hours to get it..saying the camp time is definatly required imo. Flaming and name calling is not =)
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Careful man, safiya may call u a cry baby for providing this fact i think you need to insert some masculine expletives to avoid this!

Thank you for the info.
 
Syalara said:
Nope, hes not trying to get a spell changed because the camp took him awhile. You were.
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If thats what you think then you are seriously misinterpreting the 3 point outline stated in my original post. Thank you for further clarifying your inability to comprehend.
 
A. it is not a level 57 spell. It may be able to be scribed by a level 57 wizard, but he is going to need a a full group of level 65+ friends to get it for him. It is also a long camp. This is, in fact, germain to how effective the spell should be. Items are balanced by how hard they are to aquire, so are the "rare" spells.

B. the spell is crap. Argue all the issues that you want, the spell is crap. I do not have it, and I have no plans to go get it. Ever. If someone wants to walk me, very slowly, step by step, through some plan in which this spell is not completely overshadowed by virtually everything else in my currently level 60 spell book, I am listening, but I do not expect that anyone actually can. Instead, they can reply lolz or noob, implying that they possess this knowledge, but are unwilling to share it. This means, invaribly, that this knowledge does not exist.

Eight spell slots. Where does this fit in a functional lineup. Five minute recast means whatever use it has, I also have to dedicate another spell slot to the same function. This spell does not replace fetter as my "root". Fetter casts nearly as fast, for a lot less mana, as often as I like to cast it.

The resist mod is minor, at best. If I am soloing, it's not going to save me. In a group, it is not going to turn a loss into a win. In a raid, with all the other debuffs being cast on the mob, it is completely overshadowed to be irrelavent.

Maybe it is just my low tier raiding experience, but all our stuff summons. When we wipe, no one has EVER said, "Man, if only we could have rooted that guy, everything would have been better!"

Ok, it's "situational". It's not the kind of spell to keep on your bar full time. Uhmm, 5 minute recast. For it to be up when this "situation" rolls around, it kind of has to be on the bar full time. Or, are you actively telling people to exploit the client bug to refresh a spell gem? Exactly what situation allows you several minutes of prep time? Even then, with fore knowledge of the events to come, how does the spell fit on your bar? What does it replace? What "situation" is this spell worth fitting in?

So... it's damage. 2k damage, not guaranteed, maybe a partial resist, for 450 mana. but it casts fast. ONCE EVERY FIVE MINUTES. OK... I think I have discovered the "situation"! You have a Complete Healing Mob, who has less than 1500 hp left, who is in the process of casting CHEAL, and your spell gems are refreshed, and you only have two seconds before it is finished casting, and this spell is on your bar, and you remember where it is that fast, and you are the ONLY person who can damage the mob, and you still have 450 mana, and you have not used the spell in the last 5 minutes, and you have this incredible moment of net clarity, meaning you are not already 3 seconds too late, and your client is not showing the wrong HP level of the mob and you are actually correct in knowing it has 1500 hp left....

THEN...

yes, then, oh brothers and sisters...

then this spell would be better than using just about anything else in your arsenal.





Man, if i had a nickel for every time that has happened to me...
 
What am i misinterpreting? Its your own damn words.

This is a summary of your 3 point outline

1) You are afraid about getting summoned by the big bad monsters but fail to comprehend that it doesnt ROOT mobs that are root immune...and I could understand where you would have believed that by just reading what TM had posted about the spell change...BUT you have the damn spell...and failed to test it properly which is obvious yet you post how the same spell should be changed???? /boggle


2) Here is where you compare the lvl 60 staple nuke to a situational spell......you dont have to take my word for it being situational, the recast alone tells you that. And you also state......

It took me roughly 20 hours to camp this, with a group of raid geared toons. 20 hours is not worth 100 more dmg

Hence you feel if the camp is of such a duration the spell should be better.....or maybe you think the spell should just be handed to you, idk or care.

So what am I misinterpreting?

Oh WAIT...I forgot your brilliant Third point...

Where you compare a Wizard nuke to a Pally heal.....do you understand the concept of comparing apples to oranges? Seems YOU DO INDEED.

Go punch yourself in the face for doing that. Seriously.




edit for other dudes post.....

-50 is far from a minor resist mod, its over twice the Archaics mod....so thats not even making sense. You will see this when you get to mobs with higher resists..OBV.
When you cast Archaic against a mobs weakest resist and get 4/7 full resists with the MAX CHA AVAILABLE......sometimes its nice to just click a butan and watch a nuke land.

Spell slots arent an issue unless you are trying to load up your bar to be able to handle every resist type at once + 2 harvests + a root or something....which is silly.

I have yet to have an issue with spell slots, I usually have 2 I can do without if need be.


If you guys dont wanna use it thats your call, but the spell aint gonna change all that much unless TM pops in and says he oops'd on the 5 min recast. Instead he has said he *may* reduce the cast time by .5 or reduce the mana cost a tad, niether of which effect the spell in any meaningful way from what it is now.

So maybe stop expecting this to become another normal nuke that sits in your spellbar all the time and learn to use it for what it is....or dont. I could not give a shit less what other wizards mem.
 
Then you are better off to use the Lures. if you are fighting the resists, fight the resists, don't half ass it. Even the lures are resisted on occasion. 25 more resist mod is crap... after tash and malo, who is going to notice it... once every five minutes.

The wording of the spell change made it fairly indicative that the value of the spell was in its ability to root unrootable mobs. This value was questioned in much the same way that a 2hb with a massive +peircing mod would be questioned. Since that was disputed, the queestion is now, what value does the spell have, at all?

The difficulty of obtaining an item is of issue when determining an items power.

Two drops of equal rarity from the same Mob should be of comparible value.
 
How do you figure lures are better in most situations?

Lure of the Void is 2170 base dmg for 725 mana = 3 dmg per mana spent
Lure of the Elements is usually silly but anyway its 2400 base dmg/630 mana assuming the mob issnt immune to cold or fire which knocks it down to half efficiency at best. = 3.80 dmg per mana spent..IF
Lure of Ice(60) is 825 base for 310 mana = 2.66 dmg per mana spent

Now the spell parser I use shows taraztus at 1950 base for 450 mana which is 4.33 dmg per mana spent.

Is it a great spelll? No. Is it a handy ass spell to have when you want it?? Sure.

I really dont get all the resistance towards it? Its a HUGE improvement over what it was, it has a use now and is worth farming...hopefully not for 100 rl hours though. Thats just mean. :-/
 
moghedancarns said:
woooorrrddddssss
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I notice you made precisely zero suggestions or requests about what you'd like to see the spell become.

And for the record: yes, I do have the knowledge of where the spell would be useful, and no, I'm not willing to share. To add to that: I find it very hard to believe that *any* raiding wizard would be unaware of the obvious and common situation this spell would be used in. And no, it's not fantasmagorically superamazing, but it's very similarly useful to the Paladin heal in terms of what it does and how often.

Syalara said:
hopefully not for 100 rl hours though. Thats just mean. :-/
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It's also a bullshit number.
 
I really wish I kept my logs, its not a bullshit number at all. I may be incredibly unlucky, but I have spent over 100+ hours thorugh 64/65 and never seen anyhting but the rogue mask drop
 
I cannot give suggestions on what the spell should be, I have not played a wizard long enough to develop that level of acuity. I can talk at length on the many issues plaguing shaman at many different points in their career. In fact, I have done so. Wiz has, however, made it abundantly clear that the shaman should be a boxed character, not a main played single character. Since I differ in opinion, I have changed my main, but only recently.

Whatever common situation exists, I have yet failed to experience it, or notice it if I did, through my lower tiers of raiding experience. Thus far, no one has illuminated me further on the subject. If it is viable in some later tier, so be it.
 
Thinkmeats said:
It's also a bullshit number.
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Could be bullshit, but we put in close to 80-90 hours if not more getting Bounta his paladin spell (though in that span we did see 2 Wizard spells, so maybe the paladin spell is more rare). As Bounta is a rare case, these types of things do happen. It is not probable but it is possible. Not sure on how long that other person really spent in that camp, but by the time we were done we had all gone from +25% bonus to about 20AA into being -25%.
 
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