Spell resists are too high IMO...this time with proof.
- Thread starter jhessal
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JayelleNephilim
"Helpy Helper"
I think she was referring to the fact that her toon is still stuck in a death loop. In any event, I was under the impression that the bug occurs with AEGO and low HP's while zoning period (not necessarily because it has been soulbonded).
GuiardoTuneweaver
Staff Emeritus
JayelleNephilim said:
I think this is correct. However, it only results in a death loop if it is soulbonded, because if it's not soulbonded it's gone after the first time you die. I also think it may not necessarily be due to low HP, but rather something like (unbuffed HP - HP down from full) < HP gained from aego. I've had it happen while only being down 500HP (from a mod rod), and the char had lots more unbuffed HP than that.
Hey, lets not derail the post guys...
The resists ARE pretty high for wizards in the mid level range. I posted an extensive parse of a full night's hunting on my then 29 wizard, and I showed an grand total of 30% resist/partial resists. IE 15% of his nukes were completely resisted, and 15% were partialy resisted.
This is using more than 1 type of DD too.
I posted that, and the post got locked without so much as an explanation. I feel like I put in all that effort and it's still just ignored.
The resists ARE pretty high for wizards in the mid level range. I posted an extensive parse of a full night's hunting on my then 29 wizard, and I showed an grand total of 30% resist/partial resists. IE 15% of his nukes were completely resisted, and 15% were partialy resisted.
This is using more than 1 type of DD too.
I posted that, and the post got locked without so much as an explanation. I feel like I put in all that effort and it's still just ignored.
I actually have to count on being resisted 2-3 times per mob when soloing. If it's my root or whatever, then i have to scramble. If it's my big nukes, that hurts. If i get 4 resists i'm in trouble and that happens often.
I can usually find a way to live to tell the tale, but the part that really sux is that i'm completely out of mana. That means killing one blue, then sitting for 3-5 minutes. If everything goes really well and i only get 1 or 2 resists i can kill 2 blues then sit for 5 minutes, but still, that's alot of downtime for just kilin' blues IMO.
;(
I can usually find a way to live to tell the tale, but the part that really sux is that i'm completely out of mana. That means killing one blue, then sitting for 3-5 minutes. If everything goes really well and i only get 1 or 2 resists i can kill 2 blues then sit for 5 minutes, but still, that's alot of downtime for just kilin' blues IMO.
;(
Wiz
NOT DONATING *EVER*
From all the testing done and submitted we consider resists to be fine at the moment, and aren't really going to discuss the matter any further unless it is about individual spells' resist rate ("I think spell Y should be lure resist because..."). That is why you are being "ignored".
How about the downtime issue brought up by Suul? This was a problem in EQ also: if you're 65 and want to play for half an hour then it makes no sense to look for groups (they'll mostly get mad at you for leaving early). If you're one of the lucky classes able to solo, then you can still fool around and get some experience, but the 3-4 minutes of waiting time in between fights really make the game boring.
I don't have a char high enough in SoD to know if the situation is similar in here. But I don't see what the problem would be with (say) increased mana (hp for melee) regeneration when not on any NPC's hate list.
I don't have a char high enough in SoD to know if the situation is similar in here. But I don't see what the problem would be with (say) increased mana (hp for melee) regeneration when not on any NPC's hate list.
I'd just like to chip in a little something.
Keep in mind that some mobs are exceptionally resistant to certain elements, or even many elements, so choose your spell types carefully. Wizards are actually quite lucky to have a very, very low resist spell type (lures), fire, cold, and magic damage based spells. Sure, you might not be able to use your best nuke all the time, but at least use a variety of spells to see what works best.
I've been tinkering with level 30 characters, and level 50-55 (and my alts are be no means twinked, most are actually wearing horrible gear), and of course my mains (level 65), and I'm finding the resist changes perfectly fine. With my necro I just use a different kind of dot instead of my best, if I'm in that situation.
If you think it sucks for wizards with your arsenal of spell types, you are being ignorant to the other int casters, because wizard is the only caster with so many different kinds of spells at your fingertips.
If you ask me, I think alot of the people complain about resist changes haven't really looked at their other spell types (even if they aren't as mana friendly, or UBER DAMAGE). Also, don't forget, some mobs simply are just better left alone with their resist types against certain classes.
Keep in mind that some mobs are exceptionally resistant to certain elements, or even many elements, so choose your spell types carefully. Wizards are actually quite lucky to have a very, very low resist spell type (lures), fire, cold, and magic damage based spells. Sure, you might not be able to use your best nuke all the time, but at least use a variety of spells to see what works best.
I've been tinkering with level 30 characters, and level 50-55 (and my alts are be no means twinked, most are actually wearing horrible gear), and of course my mains (level 65), and I'm finding the resist changes perfectly fine. With my necro I just use a different kind of dot instead of my best, if I'm in that situation.
If you think it sucks for wizards with your arsenal of spell types, you are being ignorant to the other int casters, because wizard is the only caster with so many different kinds of spells at your fingertips.
If you ask me, I think alot of the people complain about resist changes haven't really looked at their other spell types (even if they aren't as mana friendly, or UBER DAMAGE). Also, don't forget, some mobs simply are just better left alone with their resist types against certain classes.
Wiz said:
Ok, so in other words.. "working as intended" :lol: - fair enough.
As to the resist "types" mentioned above by Raherin, it's more than just that. I always have at least 3 different types of nukes up. You make a valid point about some mobs, but others just seem totally random on what they resist. For instance, last night I was killin Wisps. I was using root, fire nuke, shock nuke, ice nuke, and a stun. There was no rhyme or reason to the resists, all i know is that it took anwhere from 30% (with crits and no resists) to 80% (with 3-4 resists) to kill one blue. So to play it safe, i needed to make sure i had at least 80% of my mana before engaging. That means sitting between every single pull, which is all i'm saying.
Tempus
Staff Emeritus
jhessal said:
And some classes can't even solo blues! That was more the point of my sarcasm which is wholly justified in this thread. Did you actually parse the 25% - 30% resist rates of a period of time? I think 50 mins is the approved duration
In all seriousness what were you fighting? How many total casts and of which spells? How many Full resists? How many partial resists? Or did you just take a stab at a good number and call it 25 - 30%?Resist rates are fine. Having one's downtime increase as a result is debatable.
The recent trend in the mmo community is to trivialize downtime. This is not ideal because downtime helps breed community and creates a more immersive experience. I mean really, if downtime bothers you go play an FPS. That said, the only real consequence of increasing resist rates is increasing downtime. If mana regen was somehow balanced to reduce downtime to what it was the effect of resist rates would be unchanged (casters would still have to work harder than before and would be more fun imo). Returning downtime to its previous state would make soloing at least as appealing as it was and wouldn't affect group play. Only reasonable solution I can think of would be to have mana regen increase with the amount of time meditating OUT OF BATTLE.
Edited for clarity moments after OP
The recent trend in the mmo community is to trivialize downtime. This is not ideal because downtime helps breed community and creates a more immersive experience. I mean really, if downtime bothers you go play an FPS. That said, the only real consequence of increasing resist rates is increasing downtime. If mana regen was somehow balanced to reduce downtime to what it was the effect of resist rates would be unchanged (casters would still have to work harder than before and would be more fun imo). Returning downtime to its previous state would make soloing at least as appealing as it was and wouldn't affect group play. Only reasonable solution I can think of would be to have mana regen increase with the amount of time meditating OUT OF BATTLE.
Edited for clarity moments after OP
Wiz, could you please give us some indication of how much charisma is a factor in resists nowdays? I've had people say my bard at 170 charisma was kind of low. My Troll Beastlord is another story (base 45 charisma, 69 with items). Before this change I could cast with some resists, but do-able. Now after this change, I can land slow but it usaually takes several casts and Venom of the Snake I'm actually surprised when it lands. I used to cast VoTS 1-2 times per fight, nowdays I get resisted so much I've given up casting it.
What's the charisma level I should target for my Troll beastlord to be able to land spells? Or does charisma matter?
What's the charisma level I should target for my Troll beastlord to be able to land spells? Or does charisma matter?
hephasteus
Dalayan Beginner
Raherin said:
Well some of the experiences i've had have not been unusual but are nontheless very surreal. For instance i went and farmed bears with my druid and whipped out the good old level 1 flame lick spell and chain casted it to raise my evoc up the 20 points it had lagged since i had jus gotten combust. It was wild experience because it's green mob and my resists would run from 10 percent to almost 80 percent of my casts. NO SPELL that does more than one thing is easily used in the game. This really screws up chanters and druids because chanters get spells that dot and debuff or dot and stun and druids get this too. Immolate is almost completely useless because it gets resisted too much. It may be only 30 40 percent of the time but when you blow that much mana and get NOTHING for it it's a bit of inconvenience because i don't have enough mana to recatst it and have to just wait and heal through the fight and let damage sheild kill it and save my mana for another heal. Chanters soloin is a pain because NO matter what you try you can't get rid of your mana with an enchanter and you're health never goes far enough. You're pet is only good for about a minute and a half of fighting so either you HAVE to pick up agro and watch your health plummet as recast delay slowly painfully unbearably comes back. Resists aren't a problem on chanter because I can't ever use HALF my mana soloing. What is so painful about the resist issue here is that i have the 2 out of 4 characters it hits the hardest. Hurtts chanter because tashan takes time to cast, only ALLoWS me to use these dual component spells if i just blow the time it takes to cast. I pull with it but i would much rather pull with choke which AINT happening. A few levels and Anarchy will fix this somewhat but I DON"T SEE the purpose for all the hamstringing. I get the spell immolate. I need to use the spell because its part of my characters ability to kill things. But i can't. If i could stun something in SoD my chanter wouldnt ahve such a hard time but I CAN''T. This isn't a case of wizards running around Sol A trying to burn fire goblins or me trying to combust on fire goblins in Sol A. This is every freaking mob in the game. No it's not all the time. But something is broken. It affects my druid severely casue mana pool. It affects my chanter severly cause any form of agro management between me and my pet just flies out the window right from the start of the fight when you get in a nasty resist situation.. It affects wizards because people group them, the groups DPS doesn't change and they start looking for more melle and more healers. Doesn't bother a chanter in a group because the tank can keep agro so pet is just big nasty reusable DOT and you're nuke rate doesn't matter because you only get one nuke per fight with a good group anyway you do the delay part while medding afterwards. It affects necro and mage to some extent because in a group you can ALWAYS tell when a necro hit a resist patch cause you're dumping heals into them.
Tashan started out a spell to cast to help groups on super resistant mobs. Then it became a daily chore. I do not see any wisdom in giving a spell for an advantage then making you use that spell just to do anything, then calling it balanced. But that is the EQ live team where they invent the stupidest things around. Like experiencing for days to be able to do another trade skill. Experiencing for days to get an AA so that making a pieces of jewelry makes any economic sense. It's all about adding something then taking it away later on and making people do something useless in the end for NOTHING. They don't really care if you logged in medding and buffing your time away in 1999 or logged in killing 2000 more mobs to get an armor that makes you even with something that dropped in a 6 hour camp 6 years before. The big rippoff of EQ is them getting you to waste enrmous amounts of time to get something that is supposed to save you time. DID anyone really get enough benifit out of the Coldain shawl to make it worth the 50 hours of effort it took to get one? NO. Raiding became a from of mass camping where instead of wasting 6 peoples time to get one item for someone in the group you waste 46 peoples time to get one item for one person in the GUILD.
The only thing I can't figure out is if Wiz loves us so much to want to keep us around here for years and years why does he yell at us all the time? I guess thats best pondered over a 2 hour mining session followed by a 1 hour ore making session followed up by a 3 minute armor making spurt with no skillups. Am i being snotty. Yes. But that's the whole problem with creating reality and then trying to get people to come live it. Thier honest emotional reactons to it can tend to suck. If you don't beleive me just ask Satan how things are going lately. CEO's aren't even trying to create unfair realities any more. They just make crap up any more and when it gets found out they just cry and whine about how they aren't bad they just want to be rich. BooHoo. You go pulling murdering dictactors out of holes these days and there's no defiance or principality they just go strait to creating reality and hoping your ok with it.
"I'm tough but fair" -Sadamn Heussein.
Ok Mr. Insane. We didn't know you were fair. I guess you're free to go.