Placeholder Tomes

R

Radaere

Dalayan Elder
I do not see any reason placeholder tomes can not be filled with experience. I understand the staff's aversion to adding new tomes, but in the end, I would rather fill worthless items with experience than needlessly pad my alternate advancement point count. What is the harm? Either they never become tomes and more time was wasted or they become tomes and the same amount of time would have been spent filling these class tomes with experience as the classes who already had implemented tomes to fill.
 
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I see some decent reasons why they shouldn't take exp yet, but I also think it's pretty obvious that there's way better reasons why they should. Heck, I'm pretty sure most anyone who would put in exp into them wouldn't mind being part of testing for balancing of ideas that are implemented. So yeah, this from a guy whose class still has 4 tomes (not derailing for that).
 
Animand said:
I see some decent reasons why they shouldn't take exp yet, but I also think it's pretty obvious that there's way better reasons why they should. Heck, I'm pretty sure most anyone who would put in exp into them wouldn't mind being part of testing for balancing of ideas that are implemented. So yeah, this from a guy whose class still has 4 tomes (not derailing for that).
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True, if tomes are already done and then implemented, there could be immediate feedback, rather than feedback a few weeks later when the tomes are finally filled.
 
I also agree this to be a good idea.

I dont have all my tomes done but i would rather put exp points into a class tome than shit_tome_27
 
Animand said:
I see some decent reasons why they shouldn't take exp yet, but I also think it's pretty obvious that there's way better reasons why they should. Heck, I'm pretty sure most anyone who would put in exp into them wouldn't mind being part of testing for balancing of ideas that are implemented. So yeah, this from a guy whose class still has 4 tomes (not derailing for that).
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I am interested to hear the arguments against being able to fill placeholder tomes.
 
Yeah I don't really see there being any good arguments against being able to fill tomes that will do nothing until the functionality is added.
 
No one said they were good arguments, just decent! There could be (1) coding difficulties involved, (2) a need to check for non-linear scaling issues beginning immediately upon starting the first codex which can't be easily tested with noticeable amounts of previously invested exp, (3) potential for a nonstandard exp amount to fill, etc.etc. These may or may not apply, but there exist some possibilities where we could give them benefit of the doubt for their choice to let us exp them. Of course, the argument for letting them be expable is far stronger! It would be nice to know if some situation applied where it's preferable to not have these tomes be expable, because not knowing if there's any real reason they aren't isn't very satisfying.
 
I believe the agreement was that these would drop only if people didn't turn around and whine that they couldn't put experience into them. These complaints are a direct violation of this agreement.
 
Tarutao said:
I believe the agreement was that these would drop only if people didn't turn around and whine that they couldn't put experience into them. These complaints are a direct violation of this agreement.
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Well, how long have these tomes been out without being implemented? As you know people are running out of things to put XP into. If you want to discourage people from XPing and make this server into a raid only game for a majority of the high tier players than by all means...
 
we mostly pushed for place holder tomes for people who had 1 type of tome to be able to get their 3s/4s off raid mobs without having to go back and farm those mobs for the simple fact that other classes already had multiple tomes and had a chance for them to drop. also some of us were out of things to exp before the place holder tomes even went in and im pretty sure nobody cared then except for those people but now that more people are at that point...
 
jew_nose_it said:
Well, how long have these tomes been out without being implemented? As you know people are running out of things to put XP into. If you want to discourage people from XPing and make this server into a raid only game for a majority of the high tier players than by all means...
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This is the opposite of the "too big a gap to reach the top end" complaints. You're probably about to get quoted in those threads now.
 
Really the gap to reach an acceptable tome count/charm to raid high tier is someting that affects new players the most which is exactly what those threads about the experience rate are about because new players are the lifeblood of any game like this due to the fact that some people quit and need to be replaced for a guild to continue existing in a meaningful way. Long-time established players like the guy who posted this thread are not in that video game player demographic largely affected by bad experience rates.
 
Lleoc said:
we mostly pushed for place holder tomes for people who had 1 type of tome to be able to get their 3s/4s off raid mobs without having to go back and farm those mobs for the simple fact that other classes already had multiple tomes and had a chance for them to drop. also some of us were out of things to exp before the place holder tomes even went in and im pretty sure nobody cared then except for those people but now that more people are at that point...
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This is the arguement used to get them into the game and Tao quotes the agreement that was come to in order to get them in the game, but I do not know if that was made public information. I do remember a hard point being driven that if we ask to let us put exp in there they would be taken away.
 
Moraelintz said:
This is the arguement used to get them into the game and Tao quotes the agreement that was come to in order to get them in the game, but I do not know if that was made public information. I do remember a hard point being driven that if we ask to let us put exp in there they would be taken away.
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I wouldn't mind seeing these tomes taken away. They do nothing and it really sucks to get Third Paladin Tome IV when you are looking for class tomes in Tur Ruj
 
The practice of having them for Turruj is A+ makes back timing much easier and if you guys are rotting tomes beat rujik and do sown trade ins.
 
It's all up to what the Dev's want to do to the game, not that they are forced to follow the most logical plan but...

If they ever intend to create three class tomes with four ranks for every class, like it seemed like they wanted from the beginning of the Ikisith "expansion", then leaving the place holder class tomes in the game really does benefit the people who play the game as a whole.

I know it seems lame when a class tome drops that does nothing currently but this is a much better and faster way for a guild to get all the needed class tomes for their guild, over them just being added as they are implemented.
 
Supposedly there will be ways to obtain opuses in the other ikkisith zones that might work a bit differently than the randomness of Spires/Tur'ruj but I guess that might be a ways off.

Also I think a better idea than allowing placeholder tomes to be exp'ed would be to finally implement the class tomes for classes that are missing them. We've had a lot of threads in the past few years that yielded a lot of creative ideas to pull from. Class tomes have been tuned and completely changed in the past, so it's not like any that are added are set in stone if a balance issue is later realized or something.
 
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