Parsing Mob

[soba]

I've written about this before but could we possibly add a parsing mob to the House utility decor items? From what I have read GM's can summon mobs specifically for the purpose of parsing and this would simply automate that process for everyone.

Just a simple lvl 60 mob or so with average all around stats and resists, insanely high regen rate and that doesn't attack (except for possibly a very low damage riposte to keep it consistent with the average mob) or change the position it is facing (to facilitate backstab parsing for rogues).Call it a (something) Dummy, with the scarecrow model to keep it somewhat realistic.This could be very close to the NPC that GM's summon, I've never taken part in a GM sponsored parse so I wouldn't know.

I believe this mob would prove to be a great boon to players and GM's alike.

 

[GuiardoTuneweaver]

This would be a great thing to have, both to allow players to provide the requested parse comparisons when making suggestions, as well as just for players to be able to experiment with on their one (for example, to have an accurate way to compare their own effectiveness with one weapon against another).

 

[articbre]

I would have to agree with this. Allowing to have a mob that doesn't attack with like 100 million hp. That way we would have a testing dummy for parses, training, etc. A sorta RP side would be that we keep a training dummy to keep us sharp in times of non-battle.

 

[soba]

This would be a great thing to have, both to allow players to provide the requested parse comparisons when making suggestions, as well as just for players to be able to experiment with on their one (for example, to have an accurate way to compare their own effectiveness with one weapon against another).

The primary reason I posted about this was for your secondary reason, there are many weapons with somewhat similar dmg/dly and/or that have a proc which muddles a persons decision as to what would be the superior choice.A good example of this is the Greatstaff of Denos, Charged Conduit, and the Spiked Obsidian Greatstaff.Denos has 1 higher base dmg, +2 fire dmg and a rune/proc buff,the Charged Conduit has a much higher base dmg, a somewhat higher dly and a proc that is easily resisted, the Spiked staff has a lower dmg/dly than the Denos staff but has a 300 dd proc with a -50 resist mod.It would be of great help to just be able to purchase a Training Dummy in your house and parse each weapon and get a definitive answer without fucking around with a variety of mobs in a zone (and dragging along a healer) with differing stats which throws off the accuracy of the parses.

Your first reason is also a good reason to have these types of NPC's available, when the inevitable posts complaining about DPS discrepancies between classes happen (as it did with Rogues and Rangers) the staff predictably (and rightly so) asks for in-depth parses to prove the players complaints.I do not see why the staff would ask for these parses, expecting them to be as accurate as possible, without providing the tools to the public to conduct these parses as efficiently as possible.Accurate parses CAN be obtained with the help of GM's but it's terribly inefficient to expect the staff to put their own lives on hold for however many hours are needed for the tests each time this sort of situation comes up when it can be rectified by a one-time coding job of a training dummy mob that can be readily purchased by anyone.This job is made even easier if there is already a preset mob type that a GM summons for these types of tests, simply make the summoning an automated process and make the mob a semi-permanent fixture in the players house until he decides to get rid of it.

Even if a staff member comes into this thread and says this coding job is not as easy as I have made it out to be they really need to think of it as a longterm benefit.In the short-term of course it's going to be more work but in the longterm it pays off simply because it automates a process that the staff had to be actively involved with before.

Allowing to have a mob that doesn't attack with like 100 million hp.

It doesn't have to have a huge amount of HP, it simply needs to have the maximum amount of regen per tick.

 

[Kelval]

I couldn't agree more.

This mob would have to have a good deal of HP and regen, so several people could parse at once. Taking turns on several hours parses would be :dumb:.

 

[soba]

I couldn't agree more.

This mob would have to have a good deal of HP and regen, so several people could parse at once. Taking turns on several hours parses would be :dumb:.

The point is to have it available as a utility decor item in your House, so you wouldn't have to share,you'd just purchase your own.

 

[Kelval]

Ok, sorry, I didn't remember the House part (did read it a couple of days ago and came back to the subject).

 

[Andorraa]

In my opinion we don't need a parsing mob, just because it will cause a lot of greif for the Devs and Wiz. There will be a huge amount of posts saying "I don't do enough dps, look at my parse!" I'm sure the devs and Wiz know where the class numbers should be, and have done parses themselves without players interjecting.

 

[Ikaa|LoveYums]

I've written about this before but could we possibly add a parsing mob to the House utility decor items? From what I have read GM's can summon mobs specifically for the purpose of parsing and this would simply automate that process for everyone.

Just a simple lvl 60 mob or so with average all around stats and resists, insanely high regen rate and that doesn't attack (except for possibly a very low damage riposte to keep it consistent with the average mob) or change the position it is facing (to facilitate backstab parsing for rogues).Call it a (something) Dummy, with the scarecrow model to keep it somewhat realistic.This could be very close to the NPC that GM's summon, I've never taken part in a GM sponsored parse so I wouldn't know.

I believe this mob would prove to be a great boon to players and GM's alike.

This would give the ability to level up weapon skills while afk, with no danger. There is a reason archery dummies are not in newport any longer.

Your idea, while sounding fun and convenient and a way to flex e-peen on paper, really doesnt have a practical use, along with a purpose that cant (and wont) be exploited.

If you want to parse yourself, turn logging on, and get a parser to examine your log files.

 

[Kelval]

This would give the ability to level up weapon skills while afk, with no danger. There is a reason archery dummies are not in newport any longer.

Your idea, while sounding fun and convenient and a way to flex e-peen on paper, really doesnt have a practical use, along with a purpose that cant (and wont) be exploited.

If you want to parse yourself, turn logging on, and get a parser to examine your log files.

Would a mob that doesn't allow you to grow your skills be impossible to create? For example, when you go in /duel, most of the skills don't grow (except bash I think).

As for the "turn the parser on" comment, when you parse, the mobs are always in a range of levels, even if you chose the same mob, their resists and level vary. Add to that the fact that at higher end the differences are admitedly counted in small %, and you are almost never able to know if your weapon is better than the other, unless it's totally blatant.
I always have /log on, and since my DPS is low, the difference between my weapons is nearly not noticeable, unless I get something much much better (but horrible aggro wise). How should I know if it's just the mob that has low resists, me on a lucky strike, or the weapon that is really better then?
That's why a reference mob would be really cool.

 

[soba]

In my opinion we don't need a parsing mob, just because it will cause a lot of greif for the Devs and Wiz. There will be a huge amount of posts saying "I don't do enough dps, look at my parse!" I'm sure the devs and Wiz know where the class numbers should be, and have done parses themselves without players interjecting.

People already make posts complaining about each class's dps this would simply give them a tool to collect data to back up their point or to make asses of themselves posting parses disproving their own claims.

This also isn't just about class dps, with this tool at your disposal you would be able to create extremely long extremely accurate parses with less tedium to, for example, back up a claim of an underpowered weapon by parsing it with weapons of the same tier or lower.You could also use it to parse spells when there are any changes made to them.

This would give the ability to level up weapon skills while afk, with no danger. There is a reason archery dummies are not in newport any longer.

Your idea, while sounding fun and convenient and a way to flex e-peen on paper, really doesnt have a practical use, along with a purpose that cant (and wont) be exploited.

If you want to parse yourself, turn logging on, and get a parser to examine your log files.

No practical use? syduck: As Kelval has pointed out stats/resists/levels vary between NPC's in a given zone.Having a static mob with no variation improves the accuracy of parses by a good margin and by being readily available and hassle free will increase the duration people will be willing to parse which will also improve their accuracy.Also I'm fairly sure NPC's can be made not to give skill raises, last time I checked you cannot get defensive skill raises from being hit by a player's pet, I'm not aware if you can get weapon skill raises by hitting them.

 

[panthernoswar]

I'd love to see a parsing mob myself, not sure how much work it would be to make skills not level up on it, but I knew it was possible to set a mobs regen to 32k a tick, kinda hard to kill a mob with that much regen. It's how they made them unkillable way back in the day on original.

 

[robopirateninja]

Since the changes to SoD regarding using a mob's level to calculate hits, resists (AFIK the way it stands now such calculations depend entirely on the mob's stats, the actual "level" of the mob does not come into play) would it be possible to prevent skillups on the targeting dummy by making it a green con mob with stats appropriate to a level 60?

 

[Danku]

I think a possible solution would be to be able to request the major domo to ready a dummy. He would then summon a dummy the same level as yourself that you could whip to your hearts content. An even better addition would be if the domo would then give you the parse information from it.

"You attacked it for 130 seconds and did 1990 points of damage. Your DPS was 15.3."

Have it include spells, procs, dots, pets, other players, etc. This would give people a chance to measure weapon differences and a common ground to speak from when speaking of parses. Only concern I could really see with that is if people were able to get skill ups on weapons via the dummy.

 

[phlit]

This would give the ability to level up weapon skills while afk, with no danger. There is a reason archery dummies are not in newport any longer.

Your idea, while sounding fun and convenient and a way to flex e-peen on paper, really doesnt have a practical use, along with a purpose that cant (and wont) be exploited.

If you want to parse yourself, turn logging on, and get a parser to examine your log files.

Pure parsing ignorance. syduck:

Though the real reason for Wiz\GMs\whatever not wanting a parse mob is mentioned in the thread, that being them not wanting 500 posts saying 'I don't do enough DPS, look...'. It's kinda understandable, though could easily be fixed with a forum devoted to parses, and someone in charge of delivering these parses to S&R or balancing disc' if deemed accurate/specific/whatever enough.

Personally still (the idea was brought up before...) for the idea - think it'd be very useful.

 

[iaeolan]

How would making many mob variables constant cause a larger influx of people incorrectly parsing themselves? syduck:

The mob won't teach people to parse so why would this be any worse than it is now?

 

[robopirateninja]

What exactly do you mean by teach people to parse? Parsing is pretty easy, its the "playing your class" part that is open to interpretation, and even if that means that people's self parses aren't going to be good for gameplay adjustments, parsing "dps that I do with weapon X equipped" versus "dps I do with weapon Y equipped" would be valuable for an individual player; even if they arent doing class-defining dps or parses they are learning which weapon lets them individually put out more dps.

 

[neodiahs]

ill just add this in : if you want some mobs in game that are good for testign weapons out on ect try the golems outside cmal. they seem to always be the same level and all that but i dont know for sure. just an idea. just bring lots of bandages =) or a heal bot

 

[iaeolan]

What exactly do you mean by teach people to parse? Parsing is pretty easy, its the "playing your class" part that is open to interpretation, and even if that means that people's self parses aren't going to be good for gameplay adjustments, parsing "dps that I do with weapon X equipped" versus "dps I do with weapon Y equipped" would be valuable for an individual player; even if they arent doing class-defining dps or parses they are learning which weapon lets them individually put out more dps.

If you were responding to me, my point was that this mob will not teach people how to parse, let a lone that parsing exists. People too inexperienced to make decent parses and evaluate them logically before making ridiculous forum post claiming something is broken will still not know how to parse, so how will this lead to countless posts about dps?

I personally would think that if there were going to be a shit ton of posts about broken dps, a parse mob control would be a whole hell of a lot better than many parses ranging across many differently scaled NPCs.

 

[soba]

If you were responding to me, my point was that this mob will not teach people how to parse, let a lone that parsing exists. People too inexperienced to make decent parses and evaluate them logically before making ridiculous forum post claiming something is broken will still not know how to parse, so how will this lead to countless posts about dps?

I personally would think that if there were going to be a shit ton of posts about broken dps, a parse mob control would be a whole hell of a lot better than many parses ranging across many differently scaled NPCs.

This is what I was going for, a mob that can be used by all players (for a nominal fee) that would weed out errors caused by fluctuating mob levels/stats/etc.If the Majordomo also calculated the DPS on this mob for the player as was suggested in this thread earlier (great suggestion btw) that would also rule out any discrepancies that would come about from using different parsing programs, YALP and EQCompanion as an example.

I was really hoping for a bit more support from the playerbase that enjoys maximizing their characters down to the last iota, by using this mob they would be getting far more accurate parses to base their equipment choices off of.At the very least I was hoping I would at least get some support from the e-peen waving masses that would enjoy posting screenshots/sigs of their DPS with a concrete mob to base their boasts off of.I am not claiming I would not be one of the e-peen wavers but it is at best a side benefit to this mob, the real benefit would be having a staff provided mob for concrete parses that could be used to point out discrepancies between class DPS, item DPS and unintended consequences of spell changes.

Could I get some sort of staff response in here as to the viability of this suggestion, or a tentative endorsement of it provided the mob could not be used for skillups and was perhaps coded by another interested member of the staff? I am by no means volunteering myself for this task as I have no coding experience whatsoever but would Wiz be open to this addition if one of them was? I am just an outsider but for example could the treasure chest mob, if it had it's regen massively increased,the model changed to the scarecrow, and would not face toward the person would it be viable for use as the mob I mentioned, with a few other tweaks? Another example, the old North Newport archery mobs seems an even better suggestion considering they didn't summon, seemed to have an amazing amount of HP and/or regen rate and didn't move, could these simply be tweaked to give no skillups? Considering the server seems to nullify skillups from player pets this seems like a fairly simple addition to them, but I am an outsider so this could be complete bullshit.

I'm just a bit dumbfounded at the lack of response considering this could be a boon to both the players and staff on this server.If this suggestion has some troubling aspects just MENTION THEM, let us think up ways to work around them,as with the skillup problem, don't just think "it'll never work because of such and such" let the playerbase come up with ideas that would rectify them, with no communication we don't know WHY you're shooting down suggestions.