Paladin DPS Stance

Miffy

Miffy

Dalayan Adventurer
Could an agro modifier please be added to the "Althuna's Fury" (/s 9) stance. Whenever I use this stance I pull agro off the maintank in about 10 seconds completely negating the point of ever using a two hander or this stance. Something like - 50% agro, otherwise with a decent two hander and tomes this stance becomes more of a deathwish than anything else :(
 
I was always curious about what Paladin stance was like, considering when I use this same(?) stance on my Shadowknight I constantly have to FD.
 
Gongoerth claimed a good number of paladins in giggly and tu, this was horrible trend was quickly stopped when they realized it was as simple as toggling it off every 30 seconds for a round or two and not by not going gung ho from the very start.
 
^^^ doing this makes the added dps of the stance completey pointless, if you have to turn attack off every 10 secs and just stand there, or not attack for the first few minutes, then this stance does not actually add the DPS option it was intended too. Also, as xach pointed out shadow knights at least have the option to drop their agro but it seems like their stance could use the same type of agro mod as well.
 
Miffy said:
^^^ doing this makes the added dps of the stance completey pointless, if you have to turn attack off every 10 secs and just stand there, or not attack for the first few minutes, then this stance does not actually add the DPS option it was intended too. Also, as xach pointed out shadow knights at least have the option to drop their agro but it seems like their stance could use the same type of agro mod as well.
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You understand that using divine aura removes your aggro right? Also I have been wanting to bring this up but the last time I tested /s 9 on my shadowknight it was still considerably worse than style 2 atleast when it came to yellow cons and reds it seemed. Is this still the case?
 
Otcho said:
You understand that using divine aura removes your aggro right? Also I have been wanting to bring this up but the last time I tested /s 9 on my shadowknight it was still considerably worse than style 2 atleast when it came to yellow cons and reds it seemed. Is this still the case?
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DA isn't an aggro wipe, it just puts you at the bottom until it fades, at least when we were playing around with it on -REDACTED- it worked like that, anyway.
 
Thade said:
DA isn't an aggro wipe, it just puts you at the bottom until it fades, at least when we were playing around with it on -REDACTED- it worked like that, anyway.
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Then why in gods name do we make all of the clerics cast it during a fight. It sure as hell put everything off me during generals dog. Eitherway crying about having to manage aggro is lol, poor rogues cant backstab when their evade fails 6 times in a row and they are stance 6 wasting all that potential dps.
 
I can, because I am super rogue.

Srsly tho, welcome to the world of Mages and Beastlords.

I think the turning off attack every now and again is a very viable solution. Nobody is going to complain that the paladin is slacking on DPS, and you can still maintain the illusion that you're maximizing your time by casting a pad or two on the tank or tossing a ghot here and there. If you do pull aggro when you don't want it, DA isn't a bad idea either, as it will give whoever is tanking some time to build a little more aggro while you stop generating for a tick or two.

Another solution could be to take a few precautionary measures elsewhere in your raid if needed, such as giving aggro generation multiplier buffs to the tank, or yelling at him a lot and telling him to be better. Having your necro toss you a target FD would also take care of aggro issues. When it comes down to it, if the tank is doing all they can to maintain aggro, it's everyone else's job to ensure they don't steal it, and that they don't over-do it before the mob is under control.
 
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If you are forced to turn off attack or DA and stop attacking, you are getting the same dps as /s 2 with a shit load of hassle. It has been especially unbearable on undead targets and it seems very unbalanced to give Knights the option of DPS with a two hander and yet one of them can't really use it. The big problem I have with DA is that it takes up a spell slot and it also has a long ass recast. I hadn't thought of the targeted FD and that might help but its still a giant pita just so a paladin can do a litte more dps. Its obviously broken when everything possible must be done just so a paladin can use this stance without dieing. Its just because paladins have no way of reducing agro unlike dps classes and SK. Considering this stance was put in to give knights an option to deal damage in a raid it would be nice if both knight classes could take full advantage of it is all I am saying.
 
Miffy said:
If you are forced to turn off attack or DA and stop attacking, you are getting the same dps as /s 2 with a shit load of hassle. It has been especially unbearable on undead targets and it seems very unbalanced to give Knights the option of DPS with a two hander and yet one of them can't really use it. The big problem I have with DA is that it takes up a spell slot and it also has a long ass recast. I hadn't thought of the targeted FD and that might help but its still a giant pita just so a paladin can do a litte more dps. Its obviously broken when everything possible must be done just so a paladin can use this stance without dieing. Its just because paladins have no way of reducing agro unlike dps classes and SK. Considering this stance was put in to give knights an option to deal damage in a raid it would be nice if both knight classes could take full advantage of it is all I am saying.
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Warriors have no means of dropping aggro.
Shadowknights can drop aggro but at the expense of dropping ALL of it.

You are not the only class who has to MANAGE their aggro, you are not the only class who has no means of dropping aggro. You are the first person I have seen cry about this though. If you cant handle actively trying to balance high dps and not pulling aggro then put your shield back on bro.


You give away your problem in the very first post, spoiler alert:
Miffy said:
Whenever I use this stance I pull agro off the maintank in about 10 seconds
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This means you are either going full out from the beginning or your tank is undertiered. I've had the joy of watching ringo and draelyn swing their divus around on a number of raids and they eventually pulled it off but were talking 60% of the mobs hp is gone and their weapons are overpowered as fuck and crit for 3000+ with a stun added.


Better suggestion: Instead of asking for an easy mode button put on your http://wiki.shardsofdalaya.com/index.php/Mask_of_Tears
 
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Otcho said:
You understand that using divine aura removes your aggro right? Also I have been wanting to bring this up but the last time I tested /s 9 on my shadowknight it was still considerably worse than style 2 atleast when it came to yellow cons and reds it seemed. Is this still the case?
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If you mean when you are tanking then yes its much worse but when I use it on raid fights is a bit more dps. The fact that you don't even know what DA or this stance does, I mean... just... :psyduck:
 
Miffy said:
If you mean when you are tanking then yes its much worse but when I use it on raid fights is a bit more dps. The fact that you don't even know what DA or this stance does, I mean... just... :psyduck:
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/s 2 was more dps last time I Parsed it, so I Don't even understand why you are using /s 9 o_O
 
Miffy said:
If you mean when you are tanking then yes its much worse but when I use it on raid fights is a bit more dps. The fact that you don't even know what DA or this stance does, I mean... just... :psyduck:
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He's still right though. Your job is to keep agro when you're tanking, and not get agro when you're not. If that means you have to do some extra work, or that your DPS numbers won't be quite as high, deal with it.
 
Last I parsed, which was a while ago, /s 9 was like 5-10% more dps. But maybe on big red nameds its not the case, since I don't go DPS mode that often its hard to compare.

Mythryn said:
He's still right though. Your job is to keep agro when you're tanking, and not get agro when you're not. If that means you have to do some extra work, or that your DPS numbers won't be quite as high, deal with it.
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Fine give me a jolt spell I will be happy to cast it, or in all seriousness a jolt potion would be cool. I guess what this thread has really brought to light is the fact that /s 9 is at best marginaly better dps than /s 2 and with a much bigger mitigation hit. If (for some reason) people are so opposed to giving the stance a minus agro component then it still needs to be changed in some way so its not just a crappy /s 2. Perhaps make it more of a burst dps stance that drasticly increases dps but drains stamina faster. In reality it doesn't matter all that much to me, I mean I spend 99.9% of the game in /s 3 or /s 2 anyway.
 
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Actually...

I think that's a really good idea you have there. I hate to potentially hijack a pally thread, but a tradeskilled -aggro consumable may not be completely awful. Call it a smoke bomb, or a concussion grenade (lookin at you pottery), or a MiB flashy thingie...beastlords, mages, and priests everywhere would probably appreciate this. There are a couple -aggro clickies out there in the raid world for classes without an aggro reducing ability/spell (tansa ring i think, and serizus neck?), and there are already tradeskilled items out there to give buffs/abilities to classes without them (rez urns, heal pots, invis/IVU pots, SoW pots, misc buffs).

Monklin deploys a smoke-screen.
(Monklin receives a short duration recourse that reduces her hate on her target by 50 pts/tick over 3 ticks, hope she doesn't get resisted!)

The more I think about it, the more I like it. Good call miff


EDIT: Nwaij just proved I had a good idea...good enough to already be implimented. <3 u germany
 
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There is allready a TS combine that drops your aggro. In fact, it removes you from all aggro lists you are on the moment you click it. It's called Weave of Existence, talk to the gruploks if you want to know more. Isn't that awesome?

And now stop crying that you have to watch aggro when DPSing, just like anyone else has to watch aggro while DPSing.
 
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