Lower-End Archery Changes?

B

Banuddar

Dalayan Beginner
It's always struck me as a little weird, in this game as well as "the other game," that any class would have AA's that would completely change their optimal style of play. For most classes, AAs are just ways of receiving extra utility and improvements to the skills that they already use. For rangers, though, AA's give them such a huge boost to archery that makes what used to be a situational ability one of their most powerful.

What I suggest, to partially remedy this, is to make "endless quiver" available to rangers starting at low levels, and do away with the AA skill completely (and perhaps replace it with something else that would be beneficial for rangers). Although the damage from archery would still be improved from AA's, this would at least make archery a feasible damage alternative for lower level rangers, without the annoying inconvenience of having to constantly resupply themselves with arrows. If you are worried that this might make rangers too powerful, it would be easy to put level restrictions on the damage of arrows that rangers can use.

Thoughts?
 
What about changing ranger's starfall to something similar to rogue's?

(this is an item that summons arrows)
 
What about changing ranger's starfall to something similar to rogue's?

(this is an item that summons arrows)
Click to expand...

That, I think, is a much more realistic idea, and one that would alleviate a good number of problems, particularly with the recent discussion about changing Endless Quiver - it would give rangers an easilly attainable way to generate infinite arrows without overpowering things. There's already Summon Arrows items, they're just not readilly available.
 
Bernat said:
What about changing ranger's starfall to something similar to rogue's?

(this is an item that summons arrows)
Click to expand...

This is a good idea.... However some pretty high end mobs drops like the only item i know of that summons arrows and its ranger only. So this idea of yours kinda trivializes it. I would suggest if something like a ranger starfall for a summoned arrows clicky gets implemented give it like 20 charges but rechargable with 50-100ish fletching. That would make several things useful (to a point)
 
Is there a reason the Huntsman's Bracelet is important as a rare, high end item? If the desire is to give rangers a reliable supply of arrows at lower levels (i.e. to make archery viable without carrying around an inventory full of arrows/supplies), it seems likely that the bracelet would be removed or replaced with something less redundant. If that's not the goal, then I would imagine such a Starfall wouldn't be implemented, charges or no.
 
Shame, I'd love to actualy do one of the ranger starfalls^^ I got tired of that damn brownie (To put it nicely) and well...i'm not giving up my range slot for a druid item><
 
What about making something similar to the Medicine bag but with arrows?

An item with 20 charges, called Packet of Arrows?, that summons stacks of arrows.
 
Bernat said:
What about making something similar to the Medicine bag but with arrows?

An item with 20 charges, called Packet of Arrows?, that summons stacks of arrows.
Click to expand...

This idea is actually fairly brilliant. It could work similarly to the multiple-charge Alchemy potions.
 
An item that summons arrows avail to a lvl 1 isnt a bad idea if it has charges and can be recharged with a short quest. An item that you quest from lvl 1 that ends up with the ability to summon arrows around 35 would be another boon but it would still need charges to be fair to the huntsman's bracers place in the game.

Then again if the quest required factioning. Getting fletching up to 180+. Multiple quests and multiple low lvl grps to complete maybe it would be a good idea. The loot needed to complete the quest could only drop off adepts, or medium high-end content.
 
zodium said:
Bernat said:
What about making something similar to the Medicine bag but with arrows?

An item with 20 charges, called Packet of Arrows?, that summons stacks of arrows.
Click to expand...

This idea is actually fairly brilliant. It could work similarly to the multiple-charge Alchemy potions.
Click to expand...

That would be cool... Similar to the potions, it could be fletched instead of bought like the medicine bag. This is a better implementation of what I suggested in the endless quiver discussion.
 
One minor hurdle with it using the fletching skill is that you're talking quite a few subcombines to get to the point of being able to make a 20 charge item that summons a stack of arrows with each charge, since you can't combine stacked items.

Think of it this way:

10 arrows combined to make a "Small Bundle of x Arrows"
10 Small Bundle's combined to make a "Large Bundle of x Arrows"
4 Large Bundle's combined in a special container to make "Quiver of x Arrows" - 20 charges of "Summon x Arrows" which summons a stack of that arrow.

It's not a bad idea though.
 
Xeldan said:
One minor hurdle with it using the fletching skill is that you're talking quite a few subcombines to get to the point of being able to make a 20 charge item that summons a stack of arrows with each charge, since you can't combine stacked items.

Think of it this way:

10 arrows combined to make a "Small Bundle of x Arrows"
10 Small Bundle's combined to make a "Large Bundle of x Arrows"
4 Large Bundle's combined in a special container to make "Quiver of x Arrows" - 20 charges of "Summon x Arrows" which summons a stack of that arrow.

It's not a bad idea though.
Click to expand...

I would imagine you would just combine things to make the bundle directly, instead of making each arrow individually and combining them all together.
 
If that were the case then making single arrows would become obsolete because you can make 20 stacks in the same amount of time. I'm pretty sure the goal behind this idea is to make arrows consume less inventory space overall - not make fletching combines completely obsolete.
 
The only issue i see with things dropping of adepts would be that any rangers higher than the said adepts wouldn't be able to do the quest it's self. I'd still run into the issue of running out of arrows mid combat as the rate I get through arrows, even using a crystaline bow is crazy, fun, but crazy. If we could carry a couple of em then it may not matter so much. Althought saying that I could always carry a few emergancy fletching supplies. Maybe if instead of being ableto make the arrows at a higher level, maybe the damage and range on the arrows sumoned could be increased with the level, say 1 and 50 up to 15-20 and ending at around 4 and 175 by 45-50.
 
Xeldan said:
If that were the case then making single arrows would become obsolete because you can make 20 stacks in the same amount of time. I'm pretty sure the goal behind this idea is to make arrows consume less inventory space overall - not make fletching combines completely obsolete.
Click to expand...

What about making the required skill much higher for the stacks? So if (arbitrary numbers) 1 dmg arrows require a skill of 20, make stacks of 1 dmg arrows trivial at 120. This would be adjusted for the type of arrow, so if 4 dmg arrows require a skill of 120 then stacks would require a skill of 220. Some higher damage arrows might not be able to be made in stacks at all, or never trivial so there's a failure rate involved.

By the time the fletcher skills up enough to make the stacks, they'll have done their time with the numerous combines to get to that skill level. The stacks might have to be made no-drop, to eliminate the argument about only needing 1 fletcher to sell to the rest of the guild/playerbase (but other trades have the same issue). After spending the time and pp to skill up, would it be considered overpowered to allow the fletchers with very high skill to "make 20 stacks in the same amount of time", considering how many arrows Rangers go through (if/when endless quiver is removed...)?
 
Xeldan said:
If that were the case then making single arrows would become obsolete because you can make 20 stacks in the same amount of time. I'm pretty sure the goal behind this idea is to make arrows consume less inventory space overall - not make fletching combines completely obsolete.
Click to expand...

The only reason mass-production would threaten fletching combines in the first place is if there was no small amount of tedium involved with making one arrow at a time, imo. Think of a gunsmith skill making one bullet at a time, or an armorer manually combining each scale on scale mail.

I'd contend that 20 of 20 is kind of high, though. Perhaps five charges of 20 stacks each, with the component expense (in time, quantity, difficulty or what have you) scaled up?
 
Bernat said:
What about making something similar to the Medicine bag but with arrows?

An item with 20 charges, called Packet of Arrows?, that summons stacks of arrows.
Click to expand...

That's eerie, I thought of this very idea yesterday and am planning to implement it.
 
Wiz said:
Bernat said:
What about making something similar to the Medicine bag but with arrows?

An item with 20 charges, called Packet of Arrows?, that summons stacks of arrows.
Click to expand...

That's eerie, I thought of this very idea yesterday and am planning to implement it.
Click to expand...

GG Wiz, that'd be great. Thanks.
 
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