how melee damage works
- Thread starter cvasihotep
- Start date
vistachiri
Dalayan Master
Sooo then are proc rates set weapon by weapon? (or gear rather b/c a few pieces proc) or is it all standardized??
cvasihotep
Dalayan Beginner
Wiz, I actually expected you to not hand out formulas. It makes it a challenge that, in a way, I like. It's frustrating to not know all the variables involved, but I'm willing to put my energy in it a bit. In the end, it's more fun I guess when you don't know all the rules of your universe. Think real life, we still don't know why everything happens how it happens.
Here are a few useful combat formulas:
Dual Wield probability = (DW Skill + Level)/4; Monks get it the highest, 78.75% ((252+65)/4).
Double Attack probability = (DA Skill + Level)/5; Monks and Warriors get it max, at 63% ((252+65)/5).
Both will get as high as 100% (you will ALWAYS hit 4 times if you are say a warrior and wield 2 weapons) with the appropriate AA's.
Monks' DW skill caps at Level*7 + 5, while every other class caps at Level*5 + 5. This means that, pre-cap (say level 30) a monk will swing more often than all other classes with the same weapons. For those who make a point that monks aren't doing enough DPS, I argue they have better DW skill, better ATK for the same strength, and large procs. I think they're safe, personally.
Flying Kick Base Damage: 25. So FK is the equivalent of a 25/60 weapon, if you manage to press it as soon as it becomes available. Of course, in reality it's something like 25/70 (1 second delay on average?).
By comparison, Kick has base damage of 6 (I think).
Triple Attack probability = unknown, possibly depends on class, with monks having around 10 percent TA's on main hand (no triples in off hand).
I don't remember the formula for rogue's backstab, but it depended linearly on the damage of the piercer in main hand and the rogue's strength. Therefore, rogues, watch those two numbers. Probably most rogues know that by now anyway.
The accuracy (number of hits) for melee attacks seems to oscillate between 48 (on yellow/white or low red mobs) and 63 (on light-blue mobs). I did have parses with 67% for green mobs, but not as reliable. Never had anything past 67, this is why archery accuracy of 88% impressed me so much.
I would have a request for Wiz, if at all possible. Is there a log of the famous "wisdom spreading" discussion called "how melee damage works" that you held a while ago? Since that is information already disclosed, I am sure it wouldn't be a big problem to sticky it somewhere?
More thoughts on this are appreciated.
Here are a few useful combat formulas:
Dual Wield probability = (DW Skill + Level)/4; Monks get it the highest, 78.75% ((252+65)/4).
Double Attack probability = (DA Skill + Level)/5; Monks and Warriors get it max, at 63% ((252+65)/5).
Both will get as high as 100% (you will ALWAYS hit 4 times if you are say a warrior and wield 2 weapons) with the appropriate AA's.
Monks' DW skill caps at Level*7 + 5, while every other class caps at Level*5 + 5. This means that, pre-cap (say level 30) a monk will swing more often than all other classes with the same weapons. For those who make a point that monks aren't doing enough DPS, I argue they have better DW skill, better ATK for the same strength, and large procs. I think they're safe, personally.
Flying Kick Base Damage: 25. So FK is the equivalent of a 25/60 weapon, if you manage to press it as soon as it becomes available. Of course, in reality it's something like 25/70 (1 second delay on average?).
By comparison, Kick has base damage of 6 (I think).
Triple Attack probability = unknown, possibly depends on class, with monks having around 10 percent TA's on main hand (no triples in off hand).
I don't remember the formula for rogue's backstab, but it depended linearly on the damage of the piercer in main hand and the rogue's strength. Therefore, rogues, watch those two numbers. Probably most rogues know that by now anyway.
The accuracy (number of hits) for melee attacks seems to oscillate between 48 (on yellow/white or low red mobs) and 63 (on light-blue mobs). I did have parses with 67% for green mobs, but not as reliable. Never had anything past 67, this is why archery accuracy of 88% impressed me so much.
I would have a request for Wiz, if at all possible. Is there a log of the famous "wisdom spreading" discussion called "how melee damage works" that you held a while ago? Since that is information already disclosed, I am sure it wouldn't be a big problem to sticky it somewhere?
More thoughts on this are appreciated.
cvasihotep
Dalayan Beginner
In the ToK Wiz specifies that Weapon Skill + Offense + Dex determines % accuracy. However, I cannot believe that this accuracy is not dependent on the stats of the mob - so how does THAT come into account?
Also it says the ATK determines your max hit. Does this mean that SoD does not make a difference between Power and Skill ATK? and also between Avoidance and Mitigation AC? (i.e. is innate AC same as gear AC?)
I hope at least these questions can be answered by Wiz.
Also it says the ATK determines your max hit. Does this mean that SoD does not make a difference between Power and Skill ATK? and also between Avoidance and Mitigation AC? (i.e. is innate AC same as gear AC?)
I hope at least these questions can be answered by Wiz.
cvasihotep
Dalayan Beginner
In the formula for AC you count defense and agility, which are by excellence avoidance measures. It seems unlikely that they will be used separately in mitigation as total AC. It was known that on Live they were different, the client just had ONE number for simplicity. Of course, it is possible that Wiz changed the formulas to make mitigation depend on total AC instead of gear AC only. However, avoidance is most likely given by your Defense Skill in particular, with AGI contributing but to a lesser extent. Otherwise, you COULD end up with huge differences in avoidance values between players of the same class and similar equipment, one with say 150 AGI and one with 100. While the former WILL avoid more, I don't see the difference being say more than 1-2 percent.
It is somewhat surprising that total ATK determines your max hit, meaning there isn't a distinction between power and skill on this server?
And one other question I meant to ask. Are your hits all generated at Max Weapon Damage, and the values you actually SEE are the result of mob mitigation? Or are there two calculations - one being Random (1-MAX)*weapon damage, and then a mitigation value due to the mob's mitigation AC?
Also - is the minimum damage equal to the base damage of the weapon, minus whatever mitigation the mob gives, or does minimum damage scale a bit differently?
It is somewhat surprising that total ATK determines your max hit, meaning there isn't a distinction between power and skill on this server?
And one other question I meant to ask. Are your hits all generated at Max Weapon Damage, and the values you actually SEE are the result of mob mitigation? Or are there two calculations - one being Random (1-MAX)*weapon damage, and then a mitigation value due to the mob's mitigation AC?
Also - is the minimum damage equal to the base damage of the weapon, minus whatever mitigation the mob gives, or does minimum damage scale a bit differently?
cvasihotep
Dalayan Beginner
One more question: are hits taken from a normal distribution whose mean depends on Skill + Strength?
Oh, so many questions... Hints, hints!
Oh, so many questions... Hints, hints!
cvasihotep
Dalayan Beginner
I would have expected the distribution to be normal, but apparently it's not. Maybe normal with caps at minimum damage and maximum damamge?
By the way, how is the minimum hit calculated? I gather it depends on SKill and Level... Anyone know?
By the way, how is the minimum hit calculated? I gather it depends on SKill and Level... Anyone know?