Fletching - its trash, my suggestion to make it not so trash

[Ek02]

I have always had a curiousity for fletching on Everquest on live. However I realized that it was completely worthless and not a tradeskill to pursue for a variety of reasons. I was hoping after looking over SoD tradeskills that all of these great improvements and additions to tradeskills might have leaked into fletching. I was sadly disappointed to see that fletching is still... essentially worthless.

No class can really use bows except for rangers and rangers can also find better bows to use easily with little effort. This makes fletching almost a worthless endeavour especially since mages summon the best arrows anyways?

My suggestions

Since fletching is working with wood, string, cams, whittling knives, and etc... why not allow fletchers to make charms, necklaces, and some sort of aug? Possibly a belt buckle aug? Some sort of aug that fits only on belts.

Also possibly allowing fletchers to create augs that instead of stats add things such as Aggression + 1%? or Flowing thought I even? Recovery I?

Allow fletchers to make a variety of augments for different slots since other tradeskills are bound to one. However limit what they can make?

Charms-

If you allowed fletchers to make charms to add stats, it would allow fletching to be worth while without interfering with any other tradeskill at all. The only charms you can get really are from the charm merchant in Erudin correct? Well... she basically only sells two charms that anyone will consider buying until they are fairly wealthy. The 5pp melee one, or the 5pp caster one. Fletching could possibly add some depth to charms between the levels of 10-50 ish if fletchers would be allowed to create different types of wooden charms? I know the charm merchant is there probably for inflation issues... however, it would be nice if fletching could be intergrated into the game where there would be some sort of demand for it.

If not you could possibly allow fletching charms, which could be simply called wooden symbols, or bound figurines, or something that would give focus effects on possibly belts only? That would range from different focus effects for characters such as healing, damage increment, companion health, and etc up to level 5?

Maybe even +aggression and allow 2 augment slots, and -aggression and etc

Necklaces-

Since they work with string and wood also cant they create some sort of necklaces? Possibly a belt and bracelet also? It would be nice to have mid level items for casters and melee characters to be able to buy that add some stats and ac that are tradeskilled. I noticed there is some what a lack of available items to melee characters for their neck piece for many levels. This could also be a way trading is integrated without disturbing other tradeskills.

Even a necklace like 6 ac, 4 str, 4 sta, 10hp 10 mana would be nice considering that melee characters often dont get a neck piece I believe and often use random things?

Possibly being able to create some sort of wooden linked bracer with string? If a fletcher could create a bracer that was something like 2 ac, 2 cha, 2 int, -1% aggression? It would actually be a decent lower level caster to even higher levels.

Augments-

This is where you could actually make fletching shine.

What about if you created augments for fletching that do advanced item effects on a low scale?

Aggression - + and - 2%
Mind shield - 2%
spell ward - 3%
critical strike - 1% (dont know if that would even be reasonable)
damage reduction - 10?
stun resist - 2%

If not you could possibly create a single augment slot on belts for a fletched augment, which give focus effects as described earlier with the charms? Have it be a belt buckle augment that fits only into belts?

I personally think it would fit into the lore of fletching still and adds some depth to that tradeskill at least since it really is worthless. Adds more character customization and also allows people to not unbind their items since the pristine system has been implemented. Unbinding items is costly and maybe instead people would keep their old gear to have something like charm resist gear possibly for a certain raid mob?

Maybe even allow fletchers to make augs to specific resistances... +7 cr would be a nice aug and it would be specialized...

Basically... this is me throwing out ideas and streaming my thoughts about how I wish fletching was worthwhile but its just simply not and I think it should be looked at consider the devs have made the other trade skills so great.

Fletching is essentially more worthless than pottery or brewing is.

 

[Ikaa|LoveYums]

As i understand it, you want to take fletching, which by definition is "to feather an arrow" and a fletcher "a person who makes arrows", and throw in a whole bunch of other unrelated potential products? By definition, they shouldnt even be making bows.

I can appreciate trying to add flavor to the tradeskill, but this is more along the lines of completely throwing it out of whack by giving the tradeskill the ability to create things that are out of line with its intent. To make a comparison, by your arguments of "since fletchers work with string they should make necklaces" one could argue that "since clerics have mana and are wis casters they should get sow" and it would hold as much water.

The idea of augs is good, but the crafted augs in existance now are limited in application to the tradeskill they come from. IE: You cant put a smithed aug in a tailored piece of armor, it doesnt fit. Staying in this trend, the only place to put a fletched aug is in a bow, which would severely limit the usefulness in implementing an aug line for fletching. Having the ability to put augs all over the place would, again, throw fletching way out of line, along with that the fact that the focus effects listed are way overpowering for a crafted aug. Quest and Thaz augs have those effects, but are only available at high end. No one can craft augs with those effects.

In the end, if you dont use arrows, yeah, fletching probably wont be much use to you, but i dont think the solution is giving the tradeskill the ability to do things that no other tradeskill can do, AND overpowering it. The solution is not to use it. However, ask a ranger how worthless fletching is.

 

[Ek02]

As i understand it, you want to take fletching, which by definition is "to feather an arrow" and a fletcher "a person who makes arrows", and throw in a whole bunch of other unrelated potential products? By definition, they shouldnt even be making bows.

I can appreciate trying to add flavor to the tradeskill, but this is more along the lines of completely throwing it out of whack by giving the tradeskill the ability to create things that are out of line with its intent. To make a comparison, by your arguments of "since fletchers work with string they should make necklaces" one could argue that "since clerics have mana and are wis casters they should get sow" and it would hold as much water.

The idea of augs is good, but the crafted augs in existance now are limited in application to the tradeskill they come from. IE: You cant put a smithed aug in a tailored piece of armor, it doesnt fit. Staying in this trend, the only place to put a fletched aug is in a bow, which would severely limit the usefulness in implementing an aug line for fletching. Having the ability to put augs all over the place would, again, throw fletching way out of line, along with that the fact that the focus effects listed are way overpowering for a crafted aug. Quest and Thaz augs have those effects, but are only available at high end. No one can craft augs with those effects.

In the end, if you dont use arrows, yeah, fletching probably wont be much use to you, but i dont think the solution is giving the tradeskill the ability to do things that no other tradeskill can do, AND overpowering it. The solution is not to use it. However, ask a ranger how worthless fletching is.

The thing is fletching isnt really of use to anyone? It could use some sort of additions. Im mainly just pointing out the fletching is just a huge money sink that no one really follows because its not worthwhile in any way. Of course it could be overpowered and what I said could very well possibly be over powered however Im just tossing out an idea of what it could be. I dont think it would be a big deal if they could make an aug for specifically one slot of an item? ::shrug::

Also like I said, if you're working with wood, string, and etc, is creating a wooden emblem too far from the idea of fletching itself? You would still be working with wood, string, and etc but anyways... I mean even allowing them to create a ranged item that add stats would be nice.

Just an idea... all other tradeskills have some sort of improvements... fletching is basically 99% worthless. Cant something be done?

Id like to fletch but wont because its counter intuitive to do so even if I make a ranger.

 

[Diodimus]

I tend to find fletching to be very useful. Don't get me wrong, i still agree that its not as great as it could be. It would be nice to have higher difficulty arrows created from dropped items or maybe ore (arrow heads). I

am a non boxing ranger with limited access to other toons, so my ability to fletch 8 dmg arrows whenever i want is pretty nice if for some reason we don't have a mage come along on our raids. Also, people tend to overlook one really nice item that comes from fletching. The bow. Swiftshot is an amazing reward and well worth the effort if you don't find yourself being luckily pulled into a tier 4+ guild because swiftshot will not be replaced until you get into tier 4.

The aug idea isn't too bad of one, just make the augs fit in the bows only and have them fall in line with the other tradeskill augs.

 

[Ek02]

I tend to find fletching to be very useful. Don't get me wrong, i still agree that its not as great as it could be. It would be nice to have higher difficulty arrows created from dropped items or maybe ore (arrow heads). I

am a non boxing ranger with limited access to other toons, so my ability to fletch 8 dmg arrows whenever i want is pretty nice if for some reason we don't have a mage come along on our raids. Also, people tend to overlook one really nice item that comes from fletching. The bow. Swiftshot is an amazing reward and well worth the effort if you don't find yourself being luckily pulled into a tier 4+ guild because swiftshot will not be replaced until you get into tier 4.

The aug idea isn't too bad of one, just make the augs fit in the bows only and have them fall in line with the other tradeskill augs.

Bow augs would be nice... at least the bows could have some sort of stats making purchasing a bow possibly from a tradeskiller more appealing. for all melee classes in fact.

Well someone just told me that the devs keep saying 'no' to bow augs. So I dont know.

Really, I just felt like fletching has been relatively useless except for rangers and even then its basically just a huge money sink and doesnt benefit anyone really except for a ranger. You could broaden its horizons a bit to make it more appealing.

I guess I may have made the mistake of thinking that because other tradeskills have had improvements compared to live that you would want to round out fletching a bit more too. Fletching was relatively crap on live... was hoping SoD might have cared to make it different.

ANOTHER IDEA

Allow special arrows to be made which can add certain debuffs?

It would make arrows more useful to melee classes?

Ice Arrow - adds ice damage and a small snare? Maybe like a 10% snare? that doesnt stack with any other snare?
Fire Arrow - fire damage and maybe an ac debuff?
Mana arrows - Magic damage and drains 10 mana per arrow? (obviously could be OPd)
Stun Arrow - Arrows that have like a 5% possibility to stun for 1 or 2 seconds?
Poison arrow - small dot that can stack up to 4 times? Dot does 15 damage or something over 3 ticks?
Disease Arrow - causes debuffs to resists?
Disabling Arrow - drains atk rating?
Armor piercing arrow - lowers ac?
Other stat draining arrows?

Also to avoid any of these OPing ranger bow damage, make all of the arrows have a % chance to cause the effect. Every arrow has a 5% chance to cause the effect or something.

Anything can be properly balanced by adding % chance to cause the effect and also allowing effects to stack a certain number of times.

Just another idea...

 

[Ikaa|LoveYums]

Id like to fletch but wont because its counter intuitive to do so even if I make a ranger.

Blatantly wrong, unless you have an army of mages with heartseeker arrows standing by, buying 2 dmg arrows from the vendor wont cut it at the high end. You NEED to make better ones.

Also like I said, if you're working with wood, string, and etc, is creating a wooden emblem too far from the idea of fletching itself? You would still be working with wood, string, and etc but anyways... I mean even allowing them to create a ranged item that add stats would be nice.

Again, a logical fallacy. Ill give another more relevant example. "Jewelers work with metal and jewels. They should be able to create enchanted weapons." Same goes for "carving wooden totems to make ranged items." Logical fallacy. Now since fletchers DO make ranged items already (bows), i can see where your suggestion might lead to re-working fletched bow progression to include stats (since flecthed bows are pretty terrible), then youd have a statted ranged weapon. But whereas my suggestion falls within the line of what a fletcher does, yours does not. It simply assumes that someone who does specialized and specific work with tools and wood can simply make the wood do whatever they want, come up with something else entirely, AND have it be usable.

Im not sure if you entirely understand the way augs work, and what you are asking, because if I understand you correctly, your suggestion flat out wont work. Plate and chain armor is type 2. Cloth and leather type 5. Jewelery type 3. Now your suggestion for making a fletched aug be able to fit in a belt slot is purely impossible, because it cant be both type 2 AND 5 at the same time, and it would have to be, otherwise you limit who can use it. As i stated earlier, its possible to add aug slots to bows and give them their own aug line, but again, this is severely limited in usefulness, and honestly wouldnt be worth the time spent creating it.

You cant say that fletching is completely worthless simply because you don't have a use for it, or because it doesn't do what XYZ tradeskill does. You might as well stop if you cant come up with a better argument than "Fletching does nothing for me and doesnt transcend other tradeskills so its bad".

Im not disagreeing something should be done, and im all for supporting re-working fletched bow progression, but beyond that i dont see a whole lot of merit behind your suggestions of giving fletchers the ability to do whatever they want.

 

[Ek02]

Blatantly wrong, unless you have an army of mages with heartseeker arrows standing by, buying 2 dmg arrows from the vendor wont cut it at the high end. You NEED to make better ones.



Again, a logical fallacy. Ill give another more relevant example. "Jewelers work with metal and jewels. They should be able to create enchanted weapons." Same goes for "carving wooden totems to make ranged items." Logical fallacy. Now since fletchers DO make ranged items already (bows), i can see where your suggestion might lead to re-working fletched bow progression to include stats (since flecthed bows are pretty terrible), then youd have a statted ranged weapon. But whereas my suggestion falls within the line of what a fletcher does, yours does not. It simply assumes that someone who does specialized and specific work with tools and wood can simply make the wood do whatever they want, come up with something else entirely, AND have it be usable.

Im not sure if you entirely understand the way augs work, and what you are asking, because if I understand you correctly, your suggestion flat out wont work. Plate and chain armor is type 2. Cloth and leather type 5. Jewelery type 3. Now your suggestion for making a fletched aug be able to fit in a belt slot is purely impossible, because it cant be both type 2 AND 5 at the same time, and it would have to be, otherwise you limit who can use it. As i stated earlier, its possible to add aug slots to bows and give them their own aug line, but again, this is severely limited in usefulness, and honestly wouldnt be worth the time spent creating it.

You cant say that fletching is completely worthless simply because you don't have a use for it, or because it doesn't do what XYZ tradeskill does. You might as well stop if you cant come up with a better argument than "Fletching does nothing for me and doesnt transcend other tradeskills so its bad".

Im not disagreeing something should be done, and im all for supporting re-working fletched bow progression, but beyond that i dont see a whole lot of merit behind your suggestions of giving fletchers the ability to do whatever they want.

Well yeah, okay its not counter intuitive for a ranger... but it IS a huge money sink.

Just throwing some ideas out there. Feel free to shoot them down. Didnt know augs like that could not be implemented. Now thinking about it I guess it is a lot of work.

My main problem with fletching is that it doesnt really benefit anyone except for rangers. It if it broadened its horizons a bit it wouldnt be so bad.

If arrows that caused effects possibly were added in Id probably pick it up on my shadow knight just for fun even though its not exactly great. However pulling with snare, and using a dot arrow until a mob reached me would be worth while?

Worthless? Yeah probably... at least it would make bows fun for everyone except for rangers and add some diversity to fletching?

 

[Cyzaine]

There IS a fletching revamp that has been in the works. As is usual there is no ETA, and its not my place to give a preview on a project that isn't my own, but from what I saw the changes will help with a lot of the tradeskills weak points.

 

[Daelius]

basically, the two reasons people do fletching is silver steel bodkin arrows and swiftshot.

Now, what can be done to make fletching more viable, to both high end and others?

I like the different arrows, but would rather simplify it. Forget all the procs and what not, and make arrows with either straight elemental damage or a mix of regular and elemental damage.

For instance: Fire Arrow: 1dmg + 1 Fire damage
Silver steel Ice arrow 7dmg + 2 cold damage. (near max skill to make)

Because elemental damage can be resisted, i don't believe it to be overpowering.

Now, as for bow augs, why shouldn't a fletcher be able to make bow augs? Since bows have an aug slot already, i don't see why fletchers could not make something to fill that slot, all along the same lines as the other aug crafting levels.

 

[Ikaa|LoveYums]

Since bows have an aug slot already

???

They may, but.. i cant say i recall ever seeing one. As a matter of fact, i dont know any range items that have an aug slot off the top of my head.

i don't see why fletchers could not make something to fill that slot, all along the same lines as the other aug crafting levels.

I already covered that. Not that its not doable, but that the time invested to design build and implement something that has a VERY specific use isnt anywhere in the vicinity of a top priority. With its implementation, every bow in existance will have to be redesigned to implement the aug slot for it as well. Again it can be done, but.. thats a hell of a lot of work for little result.

 

[Gawain]

They may, but.. i cant say i recall ever seeing one. As a matter of fact, i dont know any range items that have an aug slot off the top of my head.

Many bows, if not all (i'm not sure), have a type 4 aug slot.

 

[Ikaa|LoveYums]

Yep, some do. You are correct. All dont though (Woe, Flarewynd, for example). Ill admit i didnt look at many, i just didnt recall any having it.

 

[Ek02]

Another idea...

Allow bows to have possible effects instead of arrows and have these bows be usuable by all classes archery able classes and possibly have different bows for rangers to avoid overpowering? What I mean by different bows is maybe add for ranger to be added to the list of usuable classes on a particular bow, there must be an item in addition to the ingredients to make a different bow that makes it not overpowered for rangers?

Since rangers do the most damage and other classes archery skill doesnt even reach above a certain skill level... rangers cant complain with this idea. However if some sort of effects were added to the bow then it could possibly make it worthwhile for other classes to want to purchase a bow? Its not to punish rangers by having lesser bows with abilities, however to make fletching more diverse and also make bows more fun and actually possibly worthwhile for other classes since rangers ARE ultimately the only ones who can do damage with a bow?

Snare bow - combat, 10% chance to cast snare?
Debuff Bow - 10% chance to debuff AC and stats of the mob?
Life drain bow - 10% chance to cast a dot that drains 80 life front the mob and casts it on yourself? or something...
Atk Rating drain bow - 10% chance to drain 10atk rating?

Something along these lines would be nice for classes other than rangers and make fletchers more sought by players on SoD.

Also has anyone ever suggested creating some sort of additional item that can be added into fletched bows like an item called "Targeting Reticle" that adds this spell onto bows called aimshot or something?

My suggestion for this-

Add to a zones characteristics, gravity, and wind factor. Obviously wind would be higher in outdoor zones and change more often.

Targeting Reticle adds spell ability aimshot to fletched bows. Must be equipped, recast time of 5 minutes, and when cast a mob must be targeted.

After the mob has been targeted, and spell cast, an input arises asking for you to make 3 inputs...
1.) Adjust left or right for wind of the zone
2.) Adjust for the zones gravity for the height of your shot so, up and down,
3.) Adjust your power

Make it a scale of -5 and 5 for all three inputs. If you chose an input of 0 it would mean you do not want to compensate at all. Have a final "take shot" button and when clicked the inputs are tested in an algorhythm against the zones current characteristics of gravity and wind.

For example if a zone has little gravity and no wind and too much power is input into the equation, then the arrow misses because essentially it would overshoot the mob.

Maybe a message of "Your arrow floated over the %t" could be sent to let you know you you did something wrong with either gravity or power.

If you messed up wind then a message comes to you and says "A draft has caught your arrow and sent it off course" or something.

Power could work in the sense that if a zone has higher gravity and currently has high wind, you MUST place more power into the shot of the arrow to allow it to get through the wind and force of gravity. If you dont use enough power the shot hits the ground and you receive a message "Your arrow has dug into the ground" or "Your wimpy shot was less than impressive" or something.

If the incorrect inputs are made then the mob is agro'ed, an arrow is expended, the ability on the bow must cool down before use again, and the arrow misses obviously and does nothing.

IF the correct inputs are made then for non ranger characters, the arrow and bow combination does maximum damage for the arrow and bow. If the bow or arrow has an effect that has a % chance to cast, the % chance of cast on the effect is boosted to 50%?

For a ranger-

If the correct inputs are made then their shot does a critical hit and if they are using an arrow with an effect or bow with an effect then the effect has a 80% chance to cast? or maybe even 100%?

To sense a zones current wind and its gravity... create an item called "A tail feather" or something. The feather has a right click cast ability that will tell you the zones current wind power, direction, and also gravity.

This doesnt seem it would take much programming though I dont know everything about what would be required from SoD... the algorhythm to test the users inputs vs the zones gravity and etc to make a successful shot isnt that deep or involved.

This would be a lot of fun if something like this was implemented and Id sure buy a fletched bow just to try it out. =]