Exploitation and Necromancers/ Shadowknights
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JayelleNephilim
"Helpy Helper"
Binge said:
Theatening to and/or cancelling your donator's status because something doesn't play out the way you want it to in game is not leverage, it's laughable and just makes me
.If someone brought it to my attn that it was even close to an exploit I would not have attempted to dot/evac/zone
We tried this one time, we sicked pets dotted evaced and talamr was summoned to death we then zoned, at that point we knew it simply was not going to happen. Exploit or not it did not work and as wiz said in game this would not have ever worked but you are jailed for even trying it. Do I agree with his decision in the 2 week jail time? Obviously not but then can I do anything about it ? nope ! Not my sandbox and I will be damned if I will ever mess with another mans sandbox especially one with so many toys such as the Wiz.
Server god Wiz says: Serve 13 days in jail you are lucky you are not banned.
If that is what server god wiz says then Chrux the necromancer will abide and be content that his beloved free server exists and that he can still play on it and is lucky to not be banned. <3 Chrux
We tried this one time, we sicked pets dotted evaced and talamr was summoned to death we then zoned, at that point we knew it simply was not going to happen. Exploit or not it did not work and as wiz said in game this would not have ever worked but you are jailed for even trying it. Do I agree with his decision in the 2 week jail time? Obviously not but then can I do anything about it ? nope ! Not my sandbox and I will be damned if I will ever mess with another mans sandbox especially one with so many toys such as the Wiz.
Server god Wiz says: Serve 13 days in jail you are lucky you are not banned.
If that is what server god wiz says then Chrux the necromancer will abide and be content that his beloved free server exists and that he can still play on it and is lucky to not be banned. <3 Chrux
Liam said:
This is what it comes down to, defending them because they were exploiting. They attacked Plaguefang by sending pets/dropping DoTs on it and zoning and coming back to see what that did to it. They got their asses handed to them by it. It clearly did not work, and they're obviously not out there reaping the rewards of it or anything.
They wanted to see if there was a way to kill a big named dude without a raid force. They tried and failed. As I said before, I'm only defending Rurho. He is my best friend in RL, and he called me right as I got out of work yesterday and said "Oh man i just got into huge trouble, i'm in jail for 2 weeks!". My first reaction was WTF did you do? He said, thats the thing, I'm not really sure. Then he explained to me what his group did, and I am appalled. I cannot believe this is happening.
I am not defending that what they exactly did (dot and zone) is a legitiment strategy or anything, and honestly if I was online and heard that they were gonna do that I would of laughed becuase it IS stupid what they did. But its not an exploit! If they found out that if you /dance with your pet, cast 6 spells and spin in a 360 motion it would make their pet into an unkillable machine and sent it at raid creatures, I'd be 100% behind you, but they did something that was out of the ordinary (stupid), but out of the ordinary, and Rurho was just along for the ride.
We did not get to come back and even check the mobs % we just got to dot/evac/zone and Talamr died after evac due to being summoned by the death beast plaguefang himself as the rest of us zoned to escape the same fate as him. This was not something we repeated either it was a one shot thing.
Tempus
Staff Emeritus
So lets take a Bank Robber for example.
If he doesn't successfully rob the bank, but rather tries and fails. Then no harm no foul, right?
Just because you do not successfully complete something doesn't mean that the action you were taking isn't against the rules. There is a difference between a stupid idea and a thoughtout pre-meditated plan to circumvent the system. Do you really expect us to believe he just showed up and joined a group without them explaining what was going on to him? Regardless of the success, the intent and effort were both there.
If he doesn't successfully rob the bank, but rather tries and fails. Then no harm no foul, right?
Just because you do not successfully complete something doesn't mean that the action you were taking isn't against the rules. There is a difference between a stupid idea and a thoughtout pre-meditated plan to circumvent the system. Do you really expect us to believe he just showed up and joined a group without them explaining what was going on to him? Regardless of the success, the intent and effort were both there.
Binge said:
Want to know why, exactly, it was exploiting? Because after they zone and check back on the mob, the dots would still be running but they'd get zero aggro from it, and could repeat the process indefinitely. The only reason they failed is because of timing. On that note, I personally found it to be kind of clever, had the conditions for it to be ideal, however, that does not make it somehow okay.
It was an attempt at an exploit, pure and simple, and there's no need for further argument on this subject as it's not going to change, nor are the punishments.
There is a difference between a stupid idea and a thoughtout pre-meditated plan to circumvent the system.
It was not meant to circumvent the system, I assumed it was the same thing as dotting and using feign death, although after further information by wiz upon this thread allowed me to understand that it was a means to circumvent the system.
Unfortunately this was not clear to myself or the other 5 people that I invited to attempt this encounter in such a way that we did before what happened or it would not have happened at all hence my server wide appology and further questioning to get a better understanding of things here on SOD.
I would also like to take this time to apologize to everyone who was there for inviting them to attempt such a feat, I was wrong and I am paying for my mistake and am not sure if you will ever forgive me for inviting you to attempt such a rediculous thing and being jailed for 2 weeks all because of my strat but I am more then sorry please forgive me.
Liam called me clever :lol: that alone is worth the 2 weeks <3
It was not meant to circumvent the system, I assumed it was the same thing as dotting and using feign death, although after further information by wiz upon this thread allowed me to understand that it was a means to circumvent the system.
Unfortunately this was not clear to myself or the other 5 people that I invited to attempt this encounter in such a way that we did before what happened or it would not have happened at all hence my server wide appology and further questioning to get a better understanding of things here on SOD.
I would also like to take this time to apologize to everyone who was there for inviting them to attempt such a feat, I was wrong and I am paying for my mistake and am not sure if you will ever forgive me for inviting you to attempt such a rediculous thing and being jailed for 2 weeks all because of my strat but I am more then sorry please forgive me.
Liam called me clever :lol: that alone is worth the 2 weeks <3
http://bingesod.ytmnd.com/
* I'm not staff, what I post or imply is not representitive of SoD in any way!
* I'm not staff, what I post or imply is not representitive of SoD in any way!
Manguadi
Dalayan Beginner
Tempus said:
In order to know whether or not your analogy is good we need to know the intent of those involved.
The fact is we can't say whether or not the PF group believed they were exploiting or just thought they have a clever plan. It is for this reason that punishment of some kind is necessary, though I question the motives behind a 14-day sentence.
I say this not in defense of either the staff or of the group, just to say that your analogy is not sound.
Tempus said:
I'm sorry your comparison is not valid. Thanks though. Yes he was told what was going to happen, and still didn't even fathom that it was something wrong, or something they shouldn't do. Its along the same lines as, say your killing a giant in EBL, and you slapped your dots on it, pets going to town, but suddenly theres an add! A corrupted lion walked over and started tearing you apart. So you run for the zone, and come back. Whats the first thing your gonna do? (other than heal up), check that giant, and maybe finish the job. Now this isn't exactly the same thing, but it works on the same prinicple.
So your bank robbery scenario is dumb.
Liam - Thank you for the replies, seriously. Please understand that I'm just pretty upset about this whole thing. I'm an EQ dork, who has been playing since it was in Beta. Rurho, and my other friends have always made fun of me for it. But now, years later I discovered (thanks to Wiz actually) this server, and it was a dream come true. I sat down Rurho and one of our other friends and told them about it, and bam they were sold. They jumped into EQ fresh on this server. Now that he is in trouble for something he seriously could not of comprehended as being a bad thing (rules wise), I feel I needed to do something about it. I have said what I wanted to in regards to all this, and its a matter of opinion, one of which yours holds alot more weight than mine ever does or will.
Now I just have to convince Rurho to keep playing, as he wants to quit over this
Thinkmeats
War Is Good For Business
every time donor statuses come up like this i laugh but for all the wrong reasons
JayelleNephilim
"Helpy Helper"
sp4mm said:
LMAO! :lol:
Manguadi
Dalayan Beginner
Tempus said:
Ok I didn't intend for this to become a discussion between us, but your quote asserts exactly what I said cannot be know: their intent. If you care to argue this in more detail, do so by all means, but include reasoning instead of simply emboldening your assertions.
I grant, as I did before, that the actions are what matter and do deserve punishment, but I maintain that your analogy implies an intent that cannot be known. It is, I believe, highly unlikely that they got together and said, "let's plan some exploit," but as Behn said before (although I find his post utterly unforgivable), ignorance is not an excuse. The point of my previous was to point out that your analogy is not consistent with the given situation.
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