Build faction for all cities through mob kills

[Zombu]

I have a bit of a problem. I'm KOS in Halas. I'm a dark elf necromancer, never hurt a barbarian in my life, but this KOS prevents me from selling stuff when I'm close, and prevents me from certain quests, such as Ring 3, lest I get my head busted.

Oh, and I'm dubious in Newport, too. I spent an hour trying to collect gnoll ears, but those things just were not dropping. Even though I did ring 1 and 2, I'm still dubious.

So my suggestion is that there should always be a mob you can kill that upon its death rewards faction. Sure, maybe it takes 100 to go up a level, maybe 1000 to go up to Ally, I don't care. I'd rather kill 100 green orcs than never be able to go to Halas by myself.

 

[Darian Maliken]

So basicly you'd have the same situation as with Erudin and Kobold? Its a nice idea but unless you made it an uncommon mob, and thus one lots of people will behunting for meaning that those five or six spots they spawn at will be ehavily cammed, gaining ally status with newport would then become a breeze. After all one of the reasons, or so it looks like to me, there isn't an amulet for erudin is the fact that its so easy to get faction for that city simply by killing things.

 

[Zombu]

So basicly you'd have the same situation as with Erudin and Kobold? Its a nice idea but unless you made it an uncommon mob, and thus one lots of people will behunting for meaning that those five or six spots they spawn at will be ehavily cammed, gaining ally status with newport would then become a breeze. After all one of the reasons, or so it looks like to me, there isn't an amulet for erudin is the fact that its so easy to get faction for that city simply by killing things.

I'd rather have it be a common mob (gnolls in Blackburrow) that gives a sliver of faction than an uncommon mob that gives a good amount.

I mean, seriously. How many 65s are going to spend a day in blackburrow killing everything to gain a faction level or two? Hell, I was there in my 30s trying to collect gnoll ears and I gave up in like 30 minutes. If it takes 1000 gnolls to from indifferent to Ally, I just don't see a bunch of 65s spending a week in a zone that gives them absolutely nothing just to gain some faction.

I killed hundreds of Kobolds and went up from dubious to kindly. The only reason I did that was because the warrens was the best place to level at the time. I'm level 45 now, and if blackburrow gave Newport exp, I'd do just enough to go up from dubious just so I can buy and sell crap. I sure as Hell wouldn't be camping for faction. Same thing with Halas killing orcs for faction. I'd do the minimum to sell, and be done with it.

 

[Bernat]

I was about to create a new port to discuss an idea I've had, but, as it has to do with faction, I'll post it right here.

What about the possibility to trade Fame Points for faction points? This could help with those who have accidentally screwed their faction with a city.

There could be also a long quest helping a city (faction) to turn us to the lowest dubious faction. I feel sorry for all those people who have accidentally turned KOS to Newport or some other city .

 

[Xeldan]

Touchy subject here, but I'll give my personal opinion on this. I really don't want people abusing the ability to fix their factions with a city at any time so they can kill guards at will and what not. If you become KoS with a city(whether from character creation or from actions you take), it's there for a reason. My suggestion is to be careful when you kill NPC's - especially those that don't attack you immediately. If you see a mob that looks like it may be a named, but it cons a faction that isn't KoS, I suggest not attacking it because some of the repercussions of doing so could be a loss in faction.

Edit: As for the ring quest, you should be able to invis to Alchemist Banner. I moved him for that very reason, and know of folks completing that step while KoS in Halas.

 

[Bernat]

Touchy subject here, but I'll give my personal opinion on this. I really don't want people abusing the ability to fix their factions with a city at any time so they can kill guards at will and what not. If you become KoS with a city(whether from character creation or from actions you take), it's there for a reason. My suggestion is to be careful when you kill NPC's - especially those that don't attack you immediately. If you see a mob that looks like it may be a named, but it cons a faction that isn't KoS, I suggest not attacking it because some of the repercussions of doing so could be a loss in faction.

Totally agree, but sometimes there are accidents. I think Fame Points (aka GM-Points) aren't to waste on guard killing.

There are also, some quests that give you bad faction hits with other factions (my Grobb gate necklace gave me bad faction hits with half the server, but now I think it only gives with the empty palm or something).

 

[Zombu]

Touchy subject here, but I'll give my personal opinion on this. I really don't want people abusing the ability to fix their factions with a city at any time so they can kill guards at will and what not. If you become KoS with a city(whether from character creation or from actions you take), it's there for a reason. My suggestion is to be careful when you kill NPC's - especially those that don't attack you immediately. If you see a mob that looks like it may be a named, but it cons a faction that isn't KoS, I suggest not attacking it because some of the repercussions of doing so could be a loss in faction.

Edit: As for the ring quest, you should be able to invis to Alchemist Banner. I moved him for that very reason, and know of folks completing that step while KoS in Halas.

Okay, I understand that to a point. An evil dark elf necromancer shouldn't be able to walk into the paladin guild, alright.

But how about either putting a cap on the amount of faction mobs can give, just 1 above dubious so I can sell to the city vendor?

Or perhaps, better yet, vendor outposts near cities that are 100% indifferent? It's just such a monumental pain in the ass to have to walk 4 zones away to sell some crap.

 

[Bernat]

Or perhaps, better yet, vendor outposts near cities that are 100% indifferent? It's just such a monumental pain in the ass to have to walk 4 zones away to sell some crap.

Mmmh, maybe creating a new merchant faction independent to cities? With some vendors in each city or its surroundings. I like it .

 

[Llanoldar Lluindar]

In live there were mobs that had capped amounts of faction. For instance my ogre could only get up to amiable with highpass through killing orcs.

If the mobs that you kill for bounty items gave small faction hits that capped at whatever /con the bounty token they give results in (i.e. gnolls stop at indiff, liodreth at kindly, or whatever) it would make factioning a little more reasonable. If you rely on the bounty items only it takes far too long because the drop rates are really low.

Now obviously the gate necklace is a really good item so you don't want this quest to be too easy. A good compromise would be to make getting to indifferent a lot easier to start. Then make each step after (except for warmly to ally) slightly easier; and for each progressive step make the difference smaller.

That is, make each faction step easier, but in an exponentially decreasing manner as you approach warmly. Of course this may make it too easy for people who are supposed to be KOS to get to dubiously. I don't know exactly what the goals of the dev team in regards to this are, and I don't know exactly how the faction system can be manipulated, so I'll refrain from further speculation.

 

[Aeran]

I mean, seriously. How many 65s are going to spend a day in blackburrow killing everything to gain a faction level or two? Hell, I was there in my 30s trying to collect gnoll ears and I gave up in like 30 minutes. If it takes 1000 gnolls to from indifferent to Ally, I just don't see a bunch of 65s spending a week in a zone that gives them absolutely nothing just to gain some faction.

Actually, IIRC this is how it all started. It used to be possible to get ally with Newport by just farming gnoll ears, lvl 65's were keeping the zone cleared all the time, and newbies would sell them to high levels for nice prices. Then people started to complain since Blackburrow was always camped by 1-2 lvl 65's that would prevent the people that were truly exping there to get exp, so they changed it. They were also made no drop at a time but I forgot exactly how that fit in~

 

[Wiz]

Aeran is right. The reason gnoll ears only take you to X is that people were disrupting low level gameplay.

 

[Zombu]

Aeran is right. The reason gnoll ears only take you to X is that people were disrupting low level gameplay.

But doesn't it disrupt low level gameplay if I decide to use my level 45 necro to take over BB anyway to farm the ears as long as they give me SOME faction? I can still farm and ruin their gameplay, but just not as long.

Here are some ideas worth considering, I think:

- Have certain dungeons give faction per kill, but cap it so you can't get more than indifferent doing so. No one can "farm" faction as killing gnolls will only get you so far.

- Increase drop rates for faction increasing items, ideally 1:1 (after all, how many gnolls don't have ears?) for the basic low level stuff, 3:1 for mid faction increases, and 5:1 for the biggest faction increases

- Create an independent merchant class outside of all cities that just carry the bare necessities (water, rations, backpacks, etc) so you can sell without having to go to the city.

 

[Wiz]

Yes, but since you could just as easily farm mobs that will give you more faction for longer, you probably won't, and neither will most people.

Just get this simple process through your head:

A) It was put in to fix high levels swamping Blackburrow.
B) Since the change high levels are no longer swamping Blackburrow.

So, it's working, and not due to change.

 

[Tempus]

Aeran is right. The reason gnoll ears only take you to X is that people were disrupting low level gameplay.

Ok thats fine, but why then if the drops are as rare as they are and the max faction they can get you to is capped, do they not give more faction per turnin? I solo'd there with one of my chars from the time they could enter BB until about level 18 and only managed to gain one faction level above dubious.

 

[Zombu]

Yes, but since you could just as easily farm mobs that will give you more faction for longer, you probably won't, and neither will most people.

Just get this simple process through your head:

A) It was put in to fix high levels swamping Blackburrow.
B) Since the change high levels are no longer swamping Blackburrow.

So, it's working, and not due to change.

This doesn't solve my original problem of Halas faction. I have to trek across 5 zones if I'm in Everfrost to sell shit (EF to BB to CH to N NP to NP Sewers). I don't expect, nor want, to be an ally to every faction in the game. That would be retarded. All I want is that if I am near a city, I should be able to sell my stuff close by, even if I am KOS. The two solutions to that are either increase faction (make faction quest drops more common, make mobs give faction when you kill them) or create vendors who are always indifferent outside of the KOS area.

 

[Puella]

I like the idea of being able to kill shit for factions also, but I think the repurcussions of getting low faction on SoD are very good (ie, its very hard to get faction back up once you destroy it)

Maybe there could be a way to cap faction going past apprehensive for killing the enemies of newport, or the enemies of grobb or whatever. This would at least allow a person to kill stuff in order to use vendors.

A better idea for Zombu though would be to go and get the port neck to Grobb. You'll need to invis into grobb and get into the iksar area where there are no trolls, as you are probably KoS to the trolls. Talk to the coordinator, and try to get your troll faction to dubious. Once there, and once you have the grobb port neck, you should be able to bind whereever you're fighting and port back to grobb to sell. Grimble is KoS to silver crown, and dubious to newport, but he can just port to grobb to sell stuff, so it doesnt matter.

 

[Dadi]

One thing that is a pita with the grobb neck is that 75% of the time it crashes my client =(

Also:

my Grobb gate necklace gave me bad faction hits with half the server, but now I think it only gives with the empty palm or something

Killing the guy for the last bounty token gives a sizeable faction hit to newport guards (and merchants too I think)

 

[GuiardoTuneweaver]

I don't expect, nor want, to be an ally to every faction in the game. That would be retarded.

But you want to be apprehensive or better to any faction that's close to any hunting ground?

I am near a city, I should be able to sell my stuff close by, even if I am KOS.

From a roleplay and storyline perspective, why?

The two solutions to that are either increase faction (make faction quest drops more common, make mobs give faction when you kill them) or create vendors who are always indifferent outside of the KOS area.

Again from a storyline perspective, it shouldn't be easy to get somebody to like you who currently hates you. And indifferent vendors don't make any sense either, unless they can be worked into the world in a logical way like the gypsies in NK were in live. You wouldn't expect to find caravans of gypsies conveniently camped outside every major city.

Another solution is not to hunt in Everfrost, or not to plan to leave often to "sell shit". Or, choose a race that is accepted by more of the places you wish to hunt near.

I think the way the factions work in the game make sense for the most part. As a human/half elf/dwarf, when I'm hunting in Meilech, I have to run over to Ogguk to sell. I'm KOS in Grobb, and would expect to have to spend a large amount of time and effort to change that. Racial hatred is not an easy thing to overcome.

Just my view...

Gui

 

[Tempus]

Again from a storyline perspective, it shouldn't be easy to get somebody to like you who currently hates you.

Not like you, but perhaps tolerate you being there. There is a strong difference between liking someone and allow them in your presence. Are there people at your school or job that you don't like? Do you immeadiately walk up and whip the shit out of them on sight? From a RP perspective you should be bale to get toleration anywhere, but maybe at the expense of never being truly liked in some places.

 

[GuiardoTuneweaver]

Are there people at your school or job that you don't like? Do you immeadiately walk up and whip the shit out of them on sight?

No, not at my job, but there are places in Africa where members of rival tribes will be attacked and killed on sight if they wander into a tribe's territory.

From a RP perspective you should be bale to get toleration anywhere

I agree for the most part (with exceptions, like Paladins tolerating Necros and SKs...). However, I don't think it should be easy.

Gui