A bit of Nostalgia...

G

gorgetrapper

Dalayan Beginner
I just realized how many people on this server used to be a part of the old guild "Vindication"

Code: 
Officers: Rochelle/Leanna/Treanna, Krymazator/Nimblo, Namrekca, Bormie

BARDS:

      Cydkik (DC, Lvl 56) [Waha] <EST>
      Girthy (Main, Guest, Lvl 65) [Shurley] <CST>
      Auri (Bot, Lvl 47) [Leanna] <PST> -- Willing to permanently give this char to someone I can *trust* that wants to main or dc her.


BEASTLORDS:

      Gralk (Main, Lvl 57)
      Thaxes (Main)
      Gillah (DC) [Rakguk]


CLERICS:


      Penelo (Main)
      Scorn (DC, Lvl 58 ) [Bodom]
      Nimblo (DC, Lvl 65) [Krymazator] <GMT+1, Norway>
      Rebekah (Bot, Lvl 65) [Leanna] <PST>
      Shuya (DC) [Jinu]
      Hermoso (Main)
      Balar (Alt) [Kagar] <CST>
      Arylin (Alt) [Rhunarc]


DRUIDS:

      Bormie (Main, Lvl 65, Officer) <PST>
      Namrekca (Main, Lvl 65, Officer) <EST>
      Kalssi (Main) [Moonlight]
      Shanei (Main) <CST>
      Cecilia (Main)
      Kinhuol (Main)
      Aonelynn (Main)
      Rakguk (Main)
      Pattie (DC) [Klawde]
      Treanna (Bot, Lvl 65) [Leanna] <PST>


ENCHANTERS:


      Ghaleon (DC) [Pikel]
      Eundin (DC) [Aonelynn]
      Leanna (DC, Lvl 65, Guild Leader) [Rochelle] <PST>

MAGICIANS:

      Krymazator (Main, Lvl 65, Guild Leader) <GMT+1, Norway>
      Awardis (Main, Lvl 65) <CST>
      Fethas (Main, Lvl 63) <CST>
      Salviola (Main)
      Moonlight (Main) [Kalssi]
      Deliche


MONKS:

      Dakkan (Main, Lvl 60)
      Torr (DC) [Salviola]
      Rhunarc (Main)
      Xann (Bot, Lvl 64) [Krymazator] <GMT+1, Norway>
      Rufio (Main)


NECROMANCERS:


      Avataus (Main, Lvl 60)
      Riesen (Main, Lvl 60)
      Klawde (Main, Lvl 61)
      Aralzhotha (Alt) [Krymazator]


PALADINS:

      Iven (DC) [Brond]
      Teccanina (DC) [Shanei] <CST>


RANGERS:

      Kinhuol (DC) [Kinhoul]


ROGUES:

      Pikel (Main)
      Roac (Bot) [Avatuas]
      Nimbels (Alt) [Kyrmazator] <GMT+1, Norway>


SHADOWKNIGHTS:

      Kagar (Main, Lvl 65) <CST>
      Bodom (Main, Lvl 60)
      Nuncio (Main) <PST>
      Zlandan (Main)
      Rixact (Main)


SHAMAN:

      Krisium (Main) <GMT+1, France>
      Brond (Main)
      Nuguk (DC, Lvl 57) [Kagar] <CST>
      Allanna (DC) [Rhunarc]
      Sszlilil (DC) [Nuncio] <PST>
      Extol (Alt) [Bodom]
      Sedon
      Rosk
      Ranlodar (Main) -- MIA


WARRIORS:

      Rochelle (Main, Lvl 65, 44 AA, Guild Leader) [Leanna] <PST>
      Krisalya (DC) [Krisium] <GMT+1, France>
      Jinu (Main)
      Hecken (Main)
      Xanthar (Alt) [Krymazator] <GMT+1, Norway>


WIZARDS:

      Shurley (Main, Lvl 65) [Girthy] <CST>
      Cyberus (Main) <EST>
      Waha (Main) <EST>
      Alexandrias (Main)
      Fliensopp (Alt) [Krymazator] <GMT+1, Norway>
      Sredni (Alt) [Rixact]

The main people I recognize are... Shurley, Waha, Krymazator, Bodom, Nuncio, Riesen, Klawde, Awardis, Bormie, Namrecka...

Man, never realized that all these people used to be in my guild... if you don't know who I was, I was Brond/Iven.

Well it sucks that I'm quitting SoD now, probably not going to show up at a later time either, sick and tired of guilds like Venerate.

Oh well, everyone have fun...... because I know I won't.

Gagluk 52 Shadowknight 12AA (retired)[/b]
 
I'm sorry you feel that way towards us Gagluk, but good job on ignoring me from day 1 when I tried to speak to you.
 
Gagluk, you do realize that *every* guild loses members to other guilds, right? Especially when they're rising.

"Guilds like Venerate"? You mean ones that accept people from other guilds who are bored or discontent and want to move up? This isn't some kind of hostile takeover, or a malicious attack on your guild. It's called attrition, and it happens any time you have just a few people at one extreme of the level range. People will always want to move on to more active guilds. Just as some HPV members joined Venerate, some of ours have left for Legacy or Ruin. Some have also come back, deciding that they preferred the atmosphere of our guild.

If you're quitting over losing 3 members of your guild who *wanted* to join another guild, you might want to step back and rethink things a little bit. 'Cause that's some crazy shit.
 
Hi Brond.
Vindication was sketchy at best. I was one of the last to leave when all that shit went down. Anyway, hope ya come back and look at the game a little less seriously, and just have some fun with it. :\
 
Hasrett said:
It's called attrition, and it happens any time you have just a few people at one extreme of the level range.
Click to expand...

Thats a very nice use of the word hasrett, and I never thought of it that way.

Besides, this is a game and not a war. If it were, attrition would be a very serious thing people would work to stop those who switch sides. But why would we do so in a game where the object is to enjoy oneself? Having people move on to a different guild because the guild there were in was not fufilling their desires in the game is normal practice and happens all the time.
I fully believe that one should not have to remain 'loyal' to a guild and suffer through a period of unhappiness in the game. Many people desire to raid often, have a large amount of people in the guild, or have decent people to talk to... if your guild was not filling these needs, a person will leave and they should.
Maybe try talking to the people that left and find out why. If you see a trend, evaluate if its better to change that factor or to lose those people.

Right now YOU are the same as those people that left Gagluk. You are leaving the guild in another manner by being inactive/quitting and have done so because a factor of the guild has made you upset or has caused you to lose interest (Loss of other people being the reason).
 
This is a LONG post

I fully believe that one should not have to remain 'loyal' to a guild and suffer through a period of unhappiness in the game. Many people desire to raid often, have a large amount of people in the guild, or have decent people to talk to... if your guild was not filling these needs, a person will leave and they should.
Maybe try talking to the people that left and find out why. If you see a trend, evaluate if its better to change that factor or to lose those people.

Right now YOU are the same as those people that left Gagluk. You are leaving the guild in another manner by being inactive/quitting and have done so because a factor of the guild has made you upset or has caused you to lose interest (Loss of other people being the reason).
Click to expand...

Wouldn't you be rather pissed if you invited people at their lower levels, helped them level up thoughout their entire character and then when they finally reach 45+ they just ditch you because a guild comes along and takes them because they are a needed class, i.e. cleric. It gets rather annoying wouldn't you think? There was no time of "unhappiness" going around in the guild, and there used to be quite a decent amount of people in on the guild every day. The only problem I could see here was that some of the people who joined are on different time zones, which caused them to THINK that noone was on in the guild. A lot of people are very sporadic in the times that they play and when they were invited, there were a lot of people on, but when they go back to when they normally play, they saw noone on because people were from a different time zone when they were invited.

I've made friends with every single person that ditched the guild to join another one. They NEVER said a word to me about leaving, not once. They just disbanded themselves from the guild. I hate having a guild become a stepping stone for another. If you're not going to stick with a guild, you shouldn't have even thought of being in it.

Having people move on to a different guild because the guild there were in was not fufilling their desires in the game is normal practice and happens all the time.
Click to expand...

They used the guild to get higher and shit, just so that they would be taken for another guild. They wouldn't be near the level they are now if I didn't sacrifice my time to power level, group with and help with anything they needed. How do they repay me? By leaving and not saying a word unless I spoke to them. That kind of crap shouldn't be tolerated but apparently if the guild who recieves them makes out in the end, why say something?

Think about it, the old guild Vindication had some GREAT players in it, but it collapsed because something happened to the guild leader Leanne (I still want to know what happened with her) and they started joining other guilds, merging with Phoenix Rising and what not... I bet if the guild stuck together and people didn't start to leave, it'd still be one of the top guilds on the server.

The problem is, people give up too easily and have people wipe their asses for them. They go join another guild that already has a foothold on the server just so that THEY can have a better foothold themselves. There's no challenge to that at all. The challenge would have to be bringing up a guild from scratch, constantly being with the guildies and helping them reach the point you are at so that your guild becomes stronger and then finally being to the point where you have a substantial amount of people in the guild, and are able to raid weekly (or daily depending on the people) like the rest of the high end guilds on the server.

This NEVER happens because people decide to take the EASIER way out, rather than being in a family guild, talking and having fun with everyone. Instead, they'd rather sit on their asses for 4 hours everyday or twice a day, setting up for a raid just so that they can become better. The lesser guilds are hurt by this because they can never become greater than they are right now because of this.

There aren't that many leaders on this server because everyone is a follower. I tried leading my guild to greater glory, but it wasn't possible when as soon as people got higher, they left.

If you're quitting over losing 3 members of your guild who *wanted* to join another guild, you might want to step back and rethink things a little bit. 'Cause that's some crazy shit.
Click to expand...

It wouldn't be such a problem if 2 of those members weren't the highest clerics/characters in the guild and another was a shaman/warrior. The ONLY reason you took them was because they were "important" to you.

I'm pretty sure if your guild started to lose such important members as those, it'd start falling apart. If your guild had no more warriors, clerics, shamans or anything like that, it would soon enough be disbanded and turned into another "Vindication". Well that's what was happening here in my guild. The important people starting leaving, which would ultimately end in disbanding because they were no longer interested in being a "family" guild after they sucked out what they could from the guild. Even the newbies who would have joined would have done the same thing in the end.

Oh and by the way I *might*, and that's a big *might*, return, but I will no longer play my SK. I found out that being a SK is useless because noone ever wants them in a group. It makes no sense because I was able to hold agro against ANYONE, and you can even ask them if that is true. I may not have had as much AC as other people, but that's because I wasn't a twink when I started.
The problem with SKs is, nothing. People don't realize SKs are awesome tanks and can dish out a fair amount of damage if they wanted to. I do believe that doubling for 170-240 per round is a fair amount of DPS, wouldn't everyone agree? (This is at level 52, just so you know). I was able to solo almost faster than a group of equal level with me. They could kill the same mob as me but I would kill it faster, it made no sense. SKs also have the spear DD line of spells that do 150dd for 50 mana and 300dd for 100 mana. That greatly adds to the DPS.
Why don't people see SKs and Paladins as DPS? I'm pretty sure that they add quite a bit of damage to the group, because I do play one. I was outdamaging some monks, and some rogues due to the amount of damage I was hitting for (believe it or not, but it's true).

So since I'm not interested in playing a SK anymore (I might later, but not now), what class would people suggest I play? I can't play a cleric, because they're rather boring just sitting on their ass all day. Can't play a warrior because they can't solo very well and groups are very hard to come by. I WANT to play a rogue, but since groups are again, hard to come by, it'd be almost impossible to play one. I played a monk before, didn't really impress me too much. I'd like to play a necro, but they don't seem to be "group" material (atleast that's how other people see it).
I don't know, I can't decide because there are too many factors in play at the moment. I'm a group kind of person, not one to want to solo.

Sorry for the long post, but I had to get things out of me.
 
I'm sorry, but if people started leaving Venerate, we wouldn't fall apart, we would just raid with Legacy 24/7 and group together like hackors.
 
Oh god, where to begin?

First, it sounds like you're pissed at the people who left your guild, not at Venerate. You haven't brought up a single thing that Venerate did wrong, other than invite your former members. You said yourself, they chose to leave your guild, for whatever reason.

That being said, have you looked at why they left? Or better yet, asked them? Tell me, what happens when someone is like 10 levels above everyone else in the guild? Quite simply, they can't group with guildies. If you have a higher level tank, that's one thing--get a lower level CHer and you're set. With a high level cleric, though, you can't do much about it. Lower level tanks can't take stuff that's good xp for a higher cleric. One of your former members told me he was tired of being unable to get a guild group, and wanted to be in a guild where he could xp and be active with the other members.

Is that so unreasonable?

As for the issues with people thinking there's no one in the guild... again, how is that anyone's fault? Why do you hate Venerate for it? If there aren't many people on during the time you play, you probably won't want to stay in that guild. Pretty straightforward.

You're pissed because those who left did so without saying a word. Isn't that something you should take up with them?

Gagluk said:
If you're not going to stick with a guild, you shouldn't have even thought of being in it.
Click to expand...
.... seriously, what world do you live in? It sounds unique and interesting. Tell me, do you honestly think there's ever been a guild that hasn't had people join it, spend a while there, and then leave, either to join friends or to move to a guild more in line with what they're looking for? What sort of guild did folks think they were joining? A guild with no raids? A high level one? A family style raid guild? Did they not know at all? It's not that hard to surmise that either A) they came in with a set of expectations that weren't met; or B) their expectations changed, and so they wanted to move on. It happens every day.

Beyond that, though, what's wrong with wanting to meet a few people and make some friends while you level, then move on? I don't know about you, but I have plenty of friends who have left guilds I've been in, here or on Live, who I continue to be friends with.

You say people give up too easily, but what should they do? Spend a month powerleveling everyone else in the guild before they can group and raid?

There aren't that many leaders? I dunno, I've seen quite a few pretty good leaders. We've got at least 3 in Venerate, and all are excellent at motivating people, encouraging people, and getting shit organized. It sounds like you're just pissed off that your leadership wasn't good enough for these people.

And for the record, Venerate "took" people because they were interested in joining us, and we had people who had grouped with them (since they couldn't get guild groups) and liked them.

Gagluk said:
This NEVER happens because people decide to take the EASIER way out, rather than being in a family guild, talking and having fun with everyone. Instead, they'd rather sit on their asses for 4 hours everyday or twice a day, setting up for a raid just so that they can become better. The lesser guilds are hurt by this because they can never become greater than they are right now because of this.
Click to expand...
Again, you're being completely unrealistic. If someone plays 3 hours a day more than everyone else in the guild, and levels 50% faster, why oh why would they want to stick with that guild? They'll be spending half their time without any of that interaction you tout, and the other half, they'd be grouping out of guild and just chatting in GC. Why do that, when you can have fun in guild chat AND in groups with guildmates, all the time?

And you say the lesser guilds can never become greater. How do you figure? I've watched venerate go from having a few members on at a time, mostly in the 30s through 50s, to have 15-20 level 55+ on at peak times, and almost always at least a full group's worth. I didn't even join the guild until I was in my low 50s, but I watched them advance while I was in the Buttercream Gang. Since I joined I've seen the average level go from 50ish to 60ish, and go from not raiding to doing improv raids several nights a week.

Also, waiting around for 4 hours a day? Some guilds prefer to just go kill something when there are enough people on and a target is up. You can make all the assumptions you want, but the simple fact is you're overreacting and throwing blame around over something that happens to everyone and is no one's fault.

My point here isn't that your guild was bad, or should have been different. It's that you can't expect everyone to want to play the way you play, at the times you play, and have the same goals as you. It's unrealistic and, if I may say so, it's stupid.
 
georgetrapper said:
This NEVER happens because people decide to take the EASIER way out, rather than being in a family guild, talking and having fun with everyone. Instead, they'd rather sit on their asses for 4 hours everyday or twice a day, setting up for a raid just so that they can become better. The lesser guilds are hurt by this because they can never become greater than they are right now because of this.
Click to expand...

I think you need to re-evaluate your guild then. family guilds in general do not advance as fast as others, this is true, but they do not gauge advancement by items, levels, or raids. I was in a 'family guild' for near most my EQlive career. It was the greatest guild I have been a part of. Every member of that guild I had some sort of connection to and we enjoyed the company of eachother in guildchat. People would join and leave every now and again, and we WOULD NOT CARE because having massive numbers etc is not what we were about, we were about having a good time with eachother.

If you're not going to stick with a guild, you shouldn't have even thought of being in it.
Click to expand...

*Please never join a guild until you are absolutely sure it is the only guild you will ever join then.* Completely unrealistic in a GAME, we are not picking sides in a civil war here.

Wouldn't you be rather pissed if you invited people at their lower levels, helped them level up thoughout their entire character and then when they finally reach 45+ they just ditch you because a guild comes along and takes them because they are a needed class, i.e. cleric.
Click to expand...

Anything you offer to the person in the form of advancement should have been out of mutual trust that the effort those people put in daily deserves whatever was given to them. Considering 2 of the members were the 'highest and the greatest' it seems they may have put into the guild more than they received, And maybe this burden of non-advancement or hinderance of abilities from other members was the main reason they wished to leave. Not everyone wants to be the top of the guild and be in a position of leadership, It's generally stressful in some form and people prefer to relax while playing a GAME.

And once again, why do you say they 'took' them? Seems the people left willingly and, in fact, accepted the invite. Sounds willing to me. Venerate did not hack these people's accounts and join them to the guild. If so, when the person logged back on they could /guildremove easily enough and you seem more then desperate to have them back.

*Whining about the SK class*
Click to expand...

Personal baggage. If this is the reason you are leaving, don't shift the blame and decide to point fingers in a forum thread which didn't ask for your input.
 
I didn't read any of it.

I wish someone had an old log of the PR members before the shit went down. It'd be funny to see everyone (even though I remember most who used to be in PR)
 
Id just like to throw my 2 cents in here and say yea this happens all the time, yea this is a game, yea we play it to have fun but people also put alot of time into it to get where they want. Its perfectly normal to be pissed off when you help someone get from level 20 to level 60 and then they ditch you for a big name guild without giving you second chance or even a reason for why they are leaving (even though that can be guessed at). And since when is it perfectly excusable to dismiss loyalty completely, even when its just a game? Ever played a team sport in high school? You didnt move to another school if your team sucked did you? Take that analogy how you want to.
 
:
If you're not going to stick with a guild, you shouldn't have even thought of being in it.
Click to expand...

Never eat peanut butter if it's not going to be your favorite food for the rest of your life :roll:
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom