Warriors vs. Knights against Mana Drain - Make Knights Mana Drain Immune?

Woot

Dalayan Adventurer
Mana Drain is a mechanic a decent amount of mobs have in SoD. Often this mana drain affects the target of the mob directly, though sometimes it's an AoE mechanic as well. When tanks have to combat mana drain, especially of the strong single target variety, Warriors don't care about it at all, whereas for Knights its a massive impediment often to the point where they just cannot be effective at all as tanks against any mob that mana drains. Knights need their mana to be able to generate and hold aggro, and if they have to sit and med most of their mana bar up every fight or every other fight, they can't be effective as tanks. For mobs with a very strong mana drain they may even run out of mana quickly during a single fight and not be able to hold aggro at all during the fight making them completely useless as tanks even against a single mob that mana drains.

With the relatively large amount of mobs that mana drain in the game is the solution to just need a warrior to be an effective tank when the group happens to run into mana draining mobs? It seems like an arbitrary and massive impediment to knights who find themselves in these situations that warriors would have zero problem with.

I'd suggest making knights mana drain immune, or giving them an AA to make them mana drain immune; even if it's just for certain types of mana drain like the single target variety that they most struggle with. If Paladins and Shadowknights are supposed to be viable tank classes, they shouldn't have to be put in a situation where they could be facing mobs they normally should be able to tank but just can't be effective tanks against because fighting them deletes their mana bar encouraging the group to find a warrior instead.
 

Nwaij

Dalayan Pious Diety
In reverse, warriors are really poor tanks on mobs you must not damage for one reason or another. Do we make an exception for that as well?
 

Woot

Dalayan Adventurer
What sort of situations are there where you can't damage a mob but also have to compete for aggro on that mob? Is warrior Taunt not sufficient in those situations? If not, it probably should be, yes.
 

Ezie3205

Dalayan Elder
What sort of situations are there where you can't damage a mob but also have to compete for aggro on that mob?

There are a number of mobs that auto riposte, making holding aggro as a warrior very aggravating.

Taunt is a garbage, nearly useless skill.

The best way to get something changed or looked at is to say it is fun. Fun is not allowed and sometimes even actively discouraged.
 

Kapitol K

Dalayan Elder
you guys should see the difference in playing stahp in bloodfires and then cynik/kharras/rokkon in bloodfires. ill just let you know its significant.
 

Otcho

Dalayan Pious Diety
you guys should see the difference in playing stahp in bloodfires and then cynik/kharras/rokkon in bloodfires. ill just let you know its significant.

I had to wonder when this thread was made if it was made in frustration shortly after tanking bloodfires or tanking faeries in trees.
I think a more realistic suggestion for this thread is that the bloodfire mobs and or other trash mobs should not function this way or at least make it resistable. Hell to date I don't even know how they work exactly.
 

Woot

Dalayan Adventurer
I had to wonder when this thread was made if it was made in frustration shortly after tanking bloodfires or tanking faeries in trees.
I think a more realistic suggestion for this thread is that the bloodfire mobs and or other trash mobs should not function this way or at least make it resistable. Hell to date I don't even know how they work exactly.
There's a long list of mobs that would need mana drain removed from them, but sure that's another option. It's a weird mechanic that massively messes with groups that use a knight tank -- but for what purpose? to single out knights and make the group want to take a warrior to anywhere you might run into mana drain mobs instead of a knight because otherwise the group goes 5-20x slower (depending on drain strength) or is just not a functional group at all?

Mobs that do this:
Bloodfires, goblin elites (shamans) in fotf, faerie dreamers in shadowdale, some dragons in DHK, horrors(?) in deepshade, various golems in sorcs lab

just to name a few.. I'm sure there are plenty more to add to the list
 
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Ceto

Dalayan Adventurer
not sure how easy this would be to make, but to complement adding a mana drain mitigation ability on knights, could also add an AA for warriors where anytime they get riposted, they get bonus hate & the riposte hit does reduced damage to the warrior, this way they can generate threat on auto riposte mobs and/or just mobs that riposte in general.

that being said, obviously this isn't going to completely fix the issue of riposte, but it's quite likely that **most** (not all) the fights with mana drains/auto riposte were created with the intent of requiring one type of tank or the other. completely negating riposte on warriors or completely negating manadrain on knights would be unhealthy for balance purposes, but would be nice to see some way to mitigate these glaring weaknesses on tank classes.
 
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Rarok

Dalayan Elder
It seems like a give an take to me. Knights and warriors, wizards and rogues, pet/buff classes/whatever. Then there is the limit of 3 per class in a group.

Just curious, is there a specific fight people can't take knights on and must use warriors? There are many examples where a warrior cannot tank and a knight is needed. A few where you must have a scout class.
 

Ceto

Dalayan Adventurer
Shadowdale I think there is a fight that mana drains vs one that auto ripostes (maybe this is only the trash and not the bosses? not certain)
 
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