Paladin Ikisith Spells

Ryst

Ryst

Dalayan Elder
Having acquired the spell, Cast Judgement, from the gruplok quest and using it, I have to make a suggestion for a change. In it's current form I cannot think of a single instance I would use this spell. In fact, I don't have it in any of my spell line-ups. The spell makes no sense for what a Paladin does. We never stand back at a distance. We are always right in front of the mobs we are attacking. Even when we are not tanking and we're DPSing instead, I would be using a 2hander and the new dps stance over this in any situation I can imagine. The only use I could think of is pulling groups, but it only works on mobs already aggro'd and seems to be resisted by the vast majority of mobs, even dark blues.

So, I propose the following:

Change the spell to a self only heal over time. Nothing major, maybe 250 mana cost, 4-5 ticks, 200 HPs per tick. Heals fit into the role of a paladin being an "auxillary healer" as descibed here on the forums before and paladins currently have no self heal over time spell.

It is just a suggestion to make the spell reward for that quest at least somewhat useful.

Thanks,

Ryst/Aynahe
 
Self heal over time I like the idea except it would be less useful now unless it stacks with all the other hots out there, would still be great for duoing I'm sure though. Runic ghot is already a pain to coordinate because of getting canceled by three other classes. Another option would be to make it a small straight up group heal. That way you avoid stacking issues give it a moderate recast / high mana cost would fill the paladin role of group healing, could also generate moderate agro.
 
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From another thread that I posted in regarding new ideas for the murk spell:

With the help of my bffs Otcho and Cinn, here are a couple of ideas to expand on something that is supposed to separate Paladins from the rest of the tanks:

Some sort of raidwide buff (with a duration resembling savagery) that gives the entire raid the ability to crit undead. I feel like this would be an excellent extension as Paladins are almost always placed in melee group for undead mobs anyway so really it picks up the stragglers - tanks, bards, and rangers.

Some sort of single target recourse style buff that when cast on an undead target gives the Paladin mitigation vs. undead that is similar or better to a Warrior or Shadowknight's mitigation on a normal target. This could be in the form of added AC, chance to parry/riposte/dodge, or maybe even a +% increase in heals.

Ideas that aren't as cool and could maybe use some work:

Another spell in the Champion of Althuna line.

Another heal in the Blessing line of self heals that has a much lower base but a much faster cooldown. A self heal like this would help alleviate the mitigation disparity between Paladins and the other tanks that prevent a Paladin from tanking at the high end due to spike damage.
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paladins don't need more goddamn self heals or self hastes!!!! nor do they need more aggro! come up w/ better ideas that are not these things and maybe but saying that there is never a time when you would want ae aggro at a distance shows a huge lack of understanding combat in any greater depth than sit in front of mob and cast blind (this is not the full story of combat).
 
how about a paladin version of cunning of the beast that gives casters the ability to get a special second crit on spells on undeads
 
Slaar there is nothing wrong with agro at a distance, in fact there is nothing wrong with this spell except it fills the identical role of the rebel spell while being inferior in every way. If there were no rebel spell I would mem the murk spell from time to time on raids, but the rebel spell is just way better. I made a longer comparison before
http://forum.shardsofdalaya.com/showthread.php?t=20898

How about a group spell damage rune, kind of like a ghetto protection of the lady, just my thought in light of recent bard changes.

Or an upgrade to the self spell damage rune (Words of Protection) could absorb more damage and have a cool effect when it broke like stun the caster who breaks it.

My other idea would be to make the murk spell an AE debuff/snare "You are burdned by the weight of your judgement"
 
Slaariel said:
paladins don't need more goddamn self heals or self hastes!!!! nor do they need more aggro! come up w/ better ideas that are not these things and maybe but saying that there is never a time when you would want ae aggro at a distance shows a huge lack of understanding combat in any greater depth than sit in front of mob and cast blind (this is not the full story of combat).
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Wow, has a paldin wronged you in another life or something? In my suggestions I never suggested another self heal, I never suggested another self haste, I never requested more aggro. I merely stated that I have not found a single reason to mem this spell to date and did suggest giving paladins a self only HoT (of which they have none at this time).

This was merely a suggestion. Take it or leave it. As is, the murk spell was a waste of time for me and will remain rotting in my paladins spell book. I would not suggest this quest to other paladins.
 
This spell is horribly useless. I kinda sorta used it on gens once, then realzied I didn't need to. Same goes for the eternal well. I have yet to come accross a single area outside of those two where i've even thought about using it.

That said, what about a self only buff, that takes off a large amount of the paladins mitigation in exchange for a large increase to healing?
 
Slaariel said:
paladins don't need more goddamn self heals or self hastes!!!! nor do they need more aggro! come up w/ better ideas that are not these things and maybe but saying that there is never a time when you would want ae aggro at a distance shows a huge lack of understanding combat in any greater depth than sit in front of mob and cast blind (this is not the full story of combat).
Click to expand...

Didn't we already have this talk in IRC? The only thing this spell is useful for is if one person pulls aggro on multiple targets. Chances are, this would only happen to a Wizard, Mage, or Shaman.. in which case the refugee spell would do the job much better as it is faster and has a -50 resist adjust on it. In addition, Descending Judgment will continue to generate aggro as the mobs come back to you.

If this spell could be used for pulling multiple targets I could see a use for it, but as it stands I feel this spell is 99% useless.

Edit: regarding your comment about self haste.. Champion of Althuna is a proc buff not self haste..

Edit 2: you didn't even comment on my first two ideas
 
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A while back someone was tossing around the idea of giving paladins an aggro spell of another magic type. Maybe if the murk spell got changed to something other than magic it might be more useful.
 
Blind Justice

X second self blind, +X (decent amount) hate normalized on swing, short duration, medium recast (2-3 min?)

Gives paladins an option to build hate on magic immune mobs that otherwise just laugh at us if bash misses. Some utility for very careful paladin MT's. Almost completely useless for AE situations.
 
without knowing a whole lot about paladins, I kind of assumed that telegraphed AE stuns would be pretty situational, so it is kind of flabbergasting to me that 2 of their ikisith spells were different types of ranged AE stuns.

I can appreciate the idea that the ikisith spells are supposed to be kind of situational spells that expand a classes abilities rather than heightening them*, so I can see the logic behind paladins not getting an upgraded healing spell, but it's still really weird that you would have 2 spells that both have a similar function for a rare situation.


*actually there are a bunch of counter-examples to this though; think of the SK refuge/murk spells, or the mage/bst pet upgrades. Not that I'm complaining about those, just saying that in some cases ikisith spells are ubiquitous rather than situational.
 
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