Hoarfrost (SK 3rd Vah sword)

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THE NEMESIS
Hoarfrost - [MAGIC ITEM] [LORE ITEM] [NO DROP] Slot: PRIMARY Skill: 1H Slash Atk Delay: 20 DMG: 16 AC: 13 Cold DMG: 2 Focus Effect: Healing Increment VI Effect: Ice Spear (Combat, 0.0) Skill Mod: Block +5% STR: +13 STA: +7 AGI: +12 INT: +10 CHA: +10 HP: +155 MANA: +185 MR: +20 FR: +5 Damage Reduction: +5 Weight: 5.4 Size: Large Class: SHD Race: ALL

I feel like the Healing Inc on this sword should instead be Damage Inc (probably a bug)

Also, the proc is WEAK. I feel like if I knew that the sword was going to lose its heal/rune line of procs for a 150 damage proc, I wouldn't have bothered upgrading to the 3rd sword for the small stat increase.

I feel like Hoarfrost is lacking in general compared to other pal/sk weapons of similar level, especially compared to:

Antediluvian Axe - [MAGIC ITEM] [LORE ITEM] [NO DROP] Slot: PRIMARY Skill: 1H Slash Atk Delay: 24 DMG: 20 AC: 17 Fire DMG: 1 Effect: Hand of Lava (Combat, 0.1) Skill Mod: Parry +3% STR: +15 STA: +15 DEX: +20 HP: +170 MANA: +125 FR: +16 CR: +16 Aggression: +1 Weight: 1.5 Size: Medium Class: PAL SHD Race: ALL

which is dropped off of mobs in Farhag wing of ToT, whos mobs you also have to kill to get a rare drop for the third level quest sword.


for reference, the 2 other sk swords

Corruption - [MAGIC ITEM] [LORE ITEM] [NO DROP] Slot: PRIMARY Skill: 1H Slash Atk Delay: 20 DMG: 15 AC: 10 Effect: Greater Healing (Combat, 1.0) Skill Mod: Block +3% STR: +5 STA: +3 AGI: +7 INT: +5 CHA: +5 HP: +120 MANA: +85 MR: +15 Damage Reduction: +2 Weight: 5.4 Size: Large Class: SHD Race: ALL

Cunning - [MAGIC ITEM] [LORE ITEM] [NO DROP] Slot: PRIMARY Skill: 1H Slash Atk Delay: 20 DMG: 15 AC: 12 Magic DMG: 2 Focus Effect: Damage Increment VI Effect: Rune III (Combat, 0.0) Skill Mod: Block +5% STR: +7 STA: +4 AGI: +9 INT: +6 CHA: +6 HP: +140 MANA: +150 MR: +18 Damage Reduction: +3 Weight: 5.4 Size: Large Class: SHD Race: ALL
 
This weapon takes significantly more effort to get then antideluvian axe. I wrote a big nice comparison post but the forum decided to log me out and i failed to copy it.


The jig:
This requires you to
1) complete the vah far enough to have the vahir readily available (See: Camp parcelan argh)
2) Camp 4 horrific and rare drops from horrific and obnoxious mobs in city of mercy, as well as the keys to the zone to access them. Sorry paladins ponightmare does not have shit on mercy camping.
3) Find and sacrifice 5 ip plate gems, and a somewhat uncommon rune from the vandathians
4) Find and sacrifice: 2 Thaz Class gems, 4 essences, a rare drop from upper earth and a very rare drop from farhags.


What do you receive? A dubiously better weapon, when you could just drop a farhag elder and walk away with the axe.

The axe has:
A higher base ratio
More HP
More AC
More Resists
Better dps stats
Aggression

The sword has:
A better ratio assuming cold damage is not resisted
More mana
Damage reduction +5
10 charisma
A better skill mod (How much better, i dont know +block is somewhat rare)
A decent focus effect if you dont already have a form of damage inc 7 (Which can be achieved from the end of farhags or ed tmaps)


I think the problem is more that antideluvian is too good but for realsies:
Up the ratio to 17+1 cold, and bring up the ac and hp to make this no comparison. Changing the proc to something more class appropriate like a lesser lifetap would own. The other swords probably need some tlc but i dont care enough to go look at all the ip tier knight onehanders. The effort required to get this should deem it to flat out shit all over antideluvians like some sort of black hawk fecal helicopter.


ps nerf antedeluvian and evolution resists and give some to varisath tia your bff otcho
 
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To be fair I think the stats on both the pally and SK versions are rather lacking compared to Anduvian. Pallies at least get it an option for hi6, but I doubt anyone who has completed up to this step wouldn't have a better alternative. That said, I really hope the SK version is bugged and not meant to be hi6.

Ideally what I think would be proportionate for the work involved would be a sword with similar hp/resists to anduvian, the current mods, and the same ratio as anduvian, but with a higher damage base. 33/40 maybe?
 
I am on the City of Mercy part... man.. serious PoNightmare X City of Mercy is hard cuz a lot of ppl are sworn althuna, and 90% of the ppl dont care about Marlow.

I am stuck in the City of Mercy part with my SK, because i can never find enough ppl willing to go there.

Also, i never thought anyone had the SK version of sword as the final version... now that u told me its stats, i am not sure if i am working on my SK Vah sword anymore =(

Duh...
 
I always thought the antedaluvian was a whee bit OP for the difficulty in obtaining it myself. This thread is definetly spot on when comparing it to the diffculty in obtaing the vah sword.
 
Ryei1 said:
I am on the City of Mercy part... man.. serious PoNightmare X City of Mercy is hard cuz a lot of ppl are sworn althuna, and 90% of the ppl dont care about Marlow.

I am stuck in the City of Mercy part with my SK, because i can never find enough ppl willing to go there.

Also, i never thought anyone had the SK version of sword as the final version... now that u told me its stats, i am not sure if i am working on my SK Vah sword anymore =(

Duh...
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This isn't the final sword. Having hoarfrost be equal to the axe would remove the reason to do the quest at all for many players, the final sword involves camping some difficult pieces that frankly most players wont see or be able to get. The same goes for the paladin sword Im just too lazy to open wiki and copy paste it.
 
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Yea, you're right. Maybe something like a .86 ratio would be better, so that these weapons would fill the gap between Anduvian and the IS sword.
 
Antediluvian. Ante (before) Diluvian (of or pertaining to deluge, used primarily for the great flood in the old testament). Antediluvian.
 
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JDJersey said:
Antediluvian. Ante (before) Diluvian (of or pertaining to deluge, used primarily for the great flood in the old testament). Antediluvian.
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I was totally lost reading his post; I had no idea what axe he was talking about. Thank you for clearing it up.

The 3rd step sk/pally vah weapons should definitely be a clear upgrade to the farhag axe since they require a rarer item from the same wing plus a whole bunchof other drops. And yeah the sk sword having healing inc seems like an oversight.

Similarly, the final sword should probably be better than varisath. Right now Nautilus is by a little bit, and the SK sword probably needs a substantial lifetap, rune, or heal proc to also be better. Assuming anyone ever gets it.
 
Antediluvian Axe - [MAGIC ITEM] [LORE ITEM] [NO DROP] Slot: PRIMARY Skill: 1H Slash Atk Delay: 24 DMG: 20 AC: 17 Fire DMG: 1 Effect: Hand of Lava (Combat, 0.1) Skill Mod: Parry +3% STR: +15 STA: +15 DEX: +20 HP: +170 MANA: +125 FR: +16 CR: +16 Aggression: +1 Weight: 1.5 Size: Medium Class: PAL SHD Race: ALL
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Arcfire - [MAGIC ITEM] [LORE ITEM] [NO DROP] Slot: PRIMARY Skill: 1H Slash Atk Delay: 20 DMG: 16 AC: 18 Fire DMG: 2 Focus Effect: Healing Increment VI Effect: Blast of Flame (Combat, 0.0) Skill Mod: Block +5% STA: +10 AGI: +15 WIS: +10 CHA: +18 HP: +135 MANA: +185 MR: +20 FR: +5 Damage Reduction: +5 Weight: 5.4 Size: Large Class: PAL Race: ALL
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Hoarfrost - [MAGIC ITEM] [LORE ITEM] [NO DROP] Slot: PRIMARY Skill: 1H Slash Atk Delay: 20 DMG: 16 AC: 13 Cold DMG: 2 Focus Effect: Damage Increment VI Effect: Ice Spear (Combat, 0.0) Skill Mod: Block +5% STR: +13 STA: +7 AGI: +12 INT: +10 CHA: +10 HP: +155 MANA: +185 MR: +20 FR: +5 Damage Reduction: +5 Weight: 5.4 Size: Large Class: SHD Race: ALL
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I am just going to bring it up again, The vah swords are statistically worse than the antediluvian axe, a far easier item to acquire. Upping the ratio to 17+1 elemental damage and bringing the hp/ac respectively up to the axe's current level would fix this dilemma. The swords are the 3rd part in a long and grueling quest and the next upgrade is significantly harder to achieve meaning that they serve little purpose for players outside of the endgame spectrum when you can just easily grab an axe because the swords aren't even an upgrade despite requiring an absurd amount of effort compared to simply killing ferdolen or any other chieftain.

I'm sure you can pull up something about how the focus effects and such outweigh the ac/hp disadvantage and I'd kindly like to tell you that they do not, both of them are easily acquired by the point you complete these swords and probably already on you or in the case of shadowknights replaced by damage inc 7. Depending on what piece of gear you have it could potentially open a new slot choice for paladins (Thaz arms->Well Arms) but really.

These swords deserve to fill the void between sanctum and non sanctum weapons but they utterly fail to do so. There is basically no incentive to do this quest for the majority of players at the moment and it saddens me.
 
I know this has been brought up many times before, and that the devs are well aware of it, but I agree that the 3rd Knight sword really isn't where it should be.. aside from the Healing Increment 6 (which any Paladin who has been farming ToT/Thaz for eternity already has in 2 or 3 forms of) there is no reason to use Arcfire over Axe.

In addition, Evolution, a drop off of a tier 7 easy snipe (two tiers below anyone that could realistically acquire an Arcfire) is very comparable.

Arcfire - [MAGIC ITEM] [LORE ITEM] [NO DROP] Slot: PRIMARY Skill: 1H Slash Atk Delay: 20 DMG: 16 AC: 18 Fire DMG: 2 Focus Effect: Healing Increment VI Effect: Blast of Flame (Combat, 0.0) Skill Mod: Block +5% STA: +10 AGI: +15 WIS: +10 CHA: +18 HP: +135 MANA: +185 MR: +20 FR: +5 Damage Reduction: +5 Weight: 5.4 Size: Large Class: PAL Race: ALL

VS.

Antediluvian Axe - [MAGIC ITEM] [LORE ITEM] [NO DROP] Slot: PRIMARY Skill: 1H Slash Atk Delay: 24 DMG: 20 AC: 17 Fire DMG: 1 Effect: Hand of Lava (Combat, 0.1) Skill Mod: Parry +3% STR: +15 STA: +15 DEX: +20 HP: +170 MANA: +125 FR: +16 CR: +16 Aggression: +1 Weight: 1.5 Size: Medium Class: PAL SHD Race: ALL

Evolution - [MAGIC ITEM] [LORE ITEM] [NO DROP] Slot: PRIMARY Skill: 1H Slash Atk Delay: 30 DMG: 24 AC: 16 Focus Effect: Range Increment VI Effect: Tishan's Discord (Combat, 0.0) Skill Mod: Riposte +4% AGI: +15 DEX: +15 WIS: +10 INT: +10 HP: +145 MANA: +125 PR: +15 DR: +15 Weight: 7.5 Size: Large Class: PAL SHD Race: ALL

EDIT: Otcho, my kindred spirit, beat me by mere seconds
 
Posting to reiterate that, having been inactive many months, I don't at all feel comfortable messing with the power level of the vah swords or any other raid-level content for that matter

If someone's gonna change it, it's gonna be zae or cyz or someone else active
 
Why bother doing a hard quest when you can just get a drop thats way better

I mean, I guess the novelty of having the vah knight sword in one of your backpacks is worth getting all those drops right.
 
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fxattack said:
Why bother doing a hard quest when you can just get a drop thats way better

I mean, I guess the novelty of having the vah knight sword in one of your backpacks is worth getting all those drops right.
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So, third vah sword = sk epic from live then? Lame...
 
Any Update?

Any update on this? I don't want to start this quest if the vah swords stay as they are.

Thanks!
 
Offically we aren't not changing them until people avoid whining about them for a full week. We've been close a few times, but it hasn't' happened yet.
 
Old 03-03-2010, 03:16 PM

Old 03-14-2010, 02:06 PM

Old 04-15-2010, 01:39 PM


Look at those delicious time stamps
 
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