Greave of the Ancient off Traekoth

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Mean Gorilla

Dalayan Beginner
After raiding Traekoth 4 times, I've seen him drop some items for most of the classes. The loot he drops is amazing for most classes to say the least. My concern is with the Greaves of the Ancient. When you compare them to other items available to not only plate classes but leather classes as well, you don't see that much of a difference. When you look at Stormforged plate greaves you will notice they actually have more AC than Greaves of the Ancient. Also if you look at a level 1 monk wearing wyvernhide leggings; he only has 5 AC less than a lvl 60 adept dragon's plate legs. In my opinion, as well as anyone who looks into it, you would have to agree that stormforged greaves are a lot easier to come by than greaves of the ancient, but stormforged greaves still have 3 AC more. When you look at the items Traekoth is dropping (Affliction V, Damage Increment V, Mana Conservation IV, Healing Increment V) you see a quality of items dropping unsurpassed by the normal items you would see a level 57 acquiring. I do see the resists and the HP factor on the legs, but I still would not consider it on the same level as the rest of Traekoth's loot. Maybe a hate effect or a proc could offset it a little.

Braxx
 
5 sta and 80 hp is absolutely stellar for plate legs. I do agree, though, that the AC might bear a small upward adjustment. 21 isn't all that much.
 
I'm just comparing items...

I'm just comparing items near that level and not seeing that huge a big difference. Aged Runic Greaves drop much more than Greaves of the Ancient and they have pretty close stats minus resists and a few HP.

Stormforged Platemail Greaves:
AC: 24
STA: +5 WIS: +6 INT: +6 HP: +45
 
You are completely ignoring the 5 sta and 80hp which is the entire selling point of the item.
 
I'm not ignoring the fact that it has +5 stamina or the +80hp. That is one of the only factors that makes me consider it a legitimate upgrade. I'm am only trying to point out that it should atleast be equal of AC if not greater to a lvl 45+ Quest piece. Even when you consider the few resists and the +35hp difference(since the stormforged have STA too), you wouldn't expect that upgrade to come from the premier adept to 50-57's. This is another way to look at it....Every piece offers other classes a substantial upgrade that is without a doubt greatly increase their gaming on the other hand this piece provides plate classes with a marginal upgrade that is inferior in what is arguably the most important plate class stat.
 
I have to agree with what MG is talking about, myself as a tank many times will drop HP to get more AC, reason been for it is that with AC you could take less damage and adds up, when you look at it in the big scale on a fight a person with higher AC at the end all that HP he saved from damage he took from having that high AC will be alot greather than the HP he could get from gear. not saying that HP is not important, but AC>all stats IMO. Those pants for being so class restricted and difficulty to get I agree that should have more AC than those obtained from a 45 lvl quest as well as more HP.
 
Laksha said:
I have to agree with what MG is talking about, myself as a tank many times will drop HP to get more AC, reason been for it is that with AC you could take less damage and adds up, when you look at it in the big scale on a fight a person with higher AC at the end all that HP he saved from damage he took from having that high AC will be alot greather than the HP he could get from gear.
Click to expand...

More HP = More efficient heals.
 
to a degree, and no, thats not right. It is a combination of both HP and AC, now I will dare to argue that more HP= better heals. I seen warriors with tons of HP but crappy AC get own in a blink of an eye. I have compared myself to many warriors of my lvl who usually have 200-300 more HP than me(SK) and in raid and group I have outtanked them because I have 200 more AC than them and with a shield. Now for a raid a CH chain heavy HP is needed, but without that AC that HP is nothing.
 
Sounds to me that no matter what side of the fence you're on the item is just right. One of those times you weigh it against other gear you have, or want, and go from there. Nothing wrong with having to make decisions now and then about what you will wear.

Eredhel
 
Uh.

Code: 
Greaves of the Ancient
MAGIC ITEM LORE ITEM NO DROP
Slot: LEGS
AC: 21
STR: +5 DEX: +4 STA: +5 AGI: +4 HP: +80
SV FIRE: +9 SV COLD: +9 SV MAGIC: +9
Weight: 10.4 Size: Large
Class: WAR PAL
Race: ALL

Code: 
Stormforged Platemail Greaves
MAGIC ITEM NO DROP
Slot: LEGS
AC: 24
STA: +5 WIS: +6 INT: +6 HP: +45
Weight: 12.0 Size: Large
Class: WAR CLE PAL SHD BRD
Race: ALL

How are these two even comparable? 3AC is the rough equivalent of 9HP, which means that the GotA legs have over 25HP on the Stormforged ones, in addition to very nice resists and melee stats. Just for giggles, let me show you the upgraded version of the Stormforged legs:

Code: 
Ornate Stormforged Platemail Greaves
MAGIC ITEM NO DROP
Slot: LEGS
AC: 29
Effect: Shield of the Storm (Must Wear Clicky)
STA: +10 WIS: +10 INT: +10 HP: +50 MANA: +50
SV POISON: +6
Weight: 12.0 Size: Large
Class: WAR CLE PAL SHD BRD
Race: ALL

These have 8 AC and 5 STA on it, plus the Resist effect, but the inherent resists and offensive melee stats (which you use for aggro generation and are extremely important on SoD) are both virtually nonexistant. And in fact, 8 AC is roughly 24HP, which means that they have an effective 74HP - six less than the much more easily attained Greaves of the Ancient. If anything, Greaves of the Ancient are overpowered, not underpowered.
 
Well, the ornate greaves win out on hp when you take sta into account, and win on resists when you take the clicky into account. I'm not saying gota is crap (though the point could be made that it's not a normal adept loot--usually, adept loot is utlity-oriented, with focuses, procs, and clickies. Having a raw stat item on an adept is counterintuitive), just that this particular comparison isn't warrented.
 
Greaves of the Ancient
MAGIC ITEM LORE ITEM NO DROP
Slot: LEGS
AC: 21
STR: +5 DEX: +4 STA: +5 AGI: +4 HP: +80
SV FIRE: +9 SV COLD: +9 SV MAGIC: +9
Weight: 10.4 Size: Large
Class: WAR PAL
Race: ALL

Not that I need these legs but being a paladin I look at alot of higher end items and am rather saddened by the lack of mana or WIS. Perhaps add 5 WIS or 25mana or both for the pallys =)
 
Mean Gorilla said:
After raiding Traekoth 4 times, I've seen him drop some items for most of the classes. The loot he drops is amazing for most classes to say the least. My concern is with the Greaves of the Ancient. When you compare them to other items available to not only plate classes but leather classes as well, you don't see that much of a difference. When you look at Stormforged plate greaves you will notice they actually have more AC than Greaves of the Ancient. Also if you look at a level 1 monk wearing wyvernhide leggings; he only has 5 AC less than a lvl 60 adept dragon's plate legs. In my opinion, as well as anyone who looks into it, you would have to agree that stormforged greaves are a lot easier to come by than greaves of the ancient, but stormforged greaves still have 3 AC more. When you look at the items Traekoth is dropping (Affliction V, Damage Increment V, Mana Conservation IV, Healing Increment V) you see a quality of items dropping unsurpassed by the normal items you would see a level 57 acquiring. I do see the resists and the HP factor on the legs, but I still would not consider it on the same level as the rest of Traekoth's loot. Maybe a hate effect or a proc could offset it a little.

Braxx
Click to expand...

I hope I don't come accross as a complete bitch, but I just couldn't bite my tongue on this one ...

I'm slightly befuttled ... er uh ... perplexed ... or maybe it's agitated! that you are now complaining about an item that you claimed before the dragon was even cold. I know a few people on the raid that would have been more than happy to of taken them off your hands. *shrug* :brow:
 
I absolutely wanted these greaves because quite frankly they were an upgrade to the item I was using at the time. You're not the first person to think I'm saying these are bad greaves when that is not the case. This post was simply a suggestion to upgrade the AC or get a potential proc to make up for the lack of AC or put it on the level of Traekoth's other class items. Please do not insult me by suggesting I took an item I didn't need. I find it odd that you would portray me as a greedy person when I thought I was helping people raid Traekoth more by organizing numerous raid on him. I have actually remained 57 beyond the time I wanted because people wanted me to raid him again and again and I really don't have a problem with that. And here is some things to show that I'm not taking items from people:

1) These are not the first pair of greaves to drop on a raid I organized.

2) After killing him 4 times and seeing roughly 16 items drop, this is the only item drop that I won. Not only that, my shaman has won nothing as well as my friend sych who has also contributed in organizing and running each raid.

3) Last raid I let numerous people from your guild attend even though before-hand they were not in my books. Not only that, but a 45 shaman from your guild was allowed to roll, and won an item that would of been more appropriately given to someone atleast 50+.

Please, I'm not trying to start a pissing match. I'm just trying to help you see that I'm not some greedy phat lewt hungry pig.
 
This thread is turning into drama and the greaves are by no means underpowered. Thread locked.
 
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