"Exploiting"

M

muurian

Dalayan Beginner
As a disclaimer, I understand that exploiting is very frustrating to the staff and admin. I would not want to be exploiting a bug or error.

However, this is Winters Roar. It is not Live. But is sort of Live.

So when my noob char in Thurgadin makes 200pp farming dwarf miners, how do I know if its a bug, an exploit, or just a good find?
Should we seek out a GM or buglist anything that seems like a good find/strategy? I do not know how extreme the price drop was on the charm merchant "exploit", but if it works, how would you not take advantage and praise the EQ gods you were an enchanter?

In light of possible banning now, I am afraid to do anything but heal PCs and cast Aegolism. Geez, I have a spell that can heal 7500 for 450 mana. Is that an exploit? It was okay in Live but who knows.

And dont say "obvious". Obvious according to whom? The developers/admin/staff of the game.

I would just like a clear and definitive answer. At what point is something an exploit as opposed to a feature?
 
Hey, there is no bugs, there is only features.
No you can't be reimbursed because it's a feature of the game.
1 weak later, the feature was "fixed"
Use your common sence.
 
Use your common sense is not a definitive answer.

It is actually the opposite of "definitive".

And there is no need to make such statements as "There is no bugs".

Its just a simple question. We're competitors, we push the game to get the strongest, fastest, bestests, whatever. We will find strategies and tactics that outsmart the game restraints. If we're going to be potentially banned for this instinct, Id like to know how exactly to be "sure" and that asking a GM every single time is A-OK with the staff.
 
First of all, we're still not going to ban for honest mistakes.

But things like charming a merchant to get cheaper prices is an exploit, since it basically lets you get anything cheaper with an enchanter or bard.

Spare me the exhaggerations. No matter what you say, common sense usually will lead you by.

When something is too good to be true (every large rat dropping a ruby, tarhyl loot in Eldenal's, getting a charm 4k cheaper just for casting a spell) it's generally an exploit.

Saying you don't know if casting CH is an exploit is silly, and is basically just trying to build up sympathy for an "Hey, I didn't know that you can't dupe! Where does the line go! Is opening my backpack a exploit too?" attitude.

To give an example.

Beating Ezcarat the Summoner by discovering that you can just charm all his pets will not get you banned.

Beating Ezcarat the SUmmoner by discovering he summons no pets if you put him in a wall will get you banned.
 
On Live, and previous WR, we used to cast Alliance or charm merchants to help with quests and prices. Thus my analogy with CH.

Your example of the Summoner is fair, but I also know of a certain incident involving a Captain Vazan that was by all accounts fair as well. That is why I was hoping a set of very direct rules could be established.

But I suppose ask the GM works too.
 
Muurian, hush.

The Vazan incident is nothing like it. That involved a bard abusing bard charm at the time to keep him indefinitely charmed. But charming him wasnt the serious issue. It was the confusion of whether or not he was used as a MT while charmed to allow Enforcer and Coralsha to be dropped. That wasn't the case. Pugg was our MT for that night, and one of his final nights as a member of ruin, and Vazan was just another pet on a leash (even though we told him to get rid of it). In the end we rolled over them with 30 members and didnt lose a single man. Vazan made no difference in the outcome.



However....

In the case of mobs with their hits and special skills set so high (ahem, PoTorment, and I again am guessing here to whether or not the mob was actually suposed ot be unkillable) they were intended, yet undecipherable at a glance, to be unkillable at the time. I suggest atleast some aggro message stating so or permently rooting them. I want to play EQ, not a guessing game. And I don't want learn I have to destroy items or leave an area an hour later because I participated in a group that inadvertantly did something the judges decided was a little too clever.
 
Training a mob away that is obviously placed to block the entrance to somewhere to get access to that place isn't considered "a little too clever."

Regardless, situation has been fixed as far as that goes.
 
It wasnt obviously blocked. We had I think 3 GMs in our 2 party raid, and none of us came to the "obvious" conclusion that we couldnt train the mob away and sneak past. After all, there are mobs in the way to other stuff that you can avoid. Clearly this was a case where "exploit" and "smart tactics" were at a very blurry line to say the least, so at least admit that it was a mistake to not permroot the mob in the first place, instead of act like we should have known better. It was a abomination, its dumb.

A moot point asyou said anyway, it is probably permrooted now.
 
On the issue of charming a merchant for better prices. I would see that as an exploit, especially considering bards and enchantes both get faction spells/songs to raise faction for just that reason or to do quests. Currently the spells are not working. But hopefully they will be in and working.
 
Duma said:
It was the confusion of whether or not he was used as a MT while charmed to allow Enforcer and Coralsha to be dropped.
Click to expand...

So what was more of the problem? That he was permacharmed via a bug or that he could have served as a 10khp+ tank?

This is what I was getting at with the Vazan example. In accordance to that event the code was changed and thus removing TWO bugs. But the ban hammer did fly and almost flew on a lot of people. It just seems like swift justice for something that benefits the server in the long run anyway.
 
On the issue of Charming a merchant to get better prices. I understand that's a bug, and I've never used. However, when you think that enchanters get the alliance line of spells shouldn't they be getting better prices anyways? The alliance spells are in, but broken. I still won't use the bug as an exploit, but just thought you should think of it from a different perspective.

Ibn'Al'Muhalla
The prophet
 
That's fine. The alliance spell impact is fairly small, much like a CHA buff.
 
LOL....That is why I quit playing WR, everything was too wishy washy at times or one sided ;(

But...on a more positive note how are all my old friends doing? Good to see WR is still going strong. I noticed the link in my favorites and decided to come check up on WR ;)....


Nazul...if you still play send me a PM.

Later :D
 
heh I miss Muurian and Chamelion back in the day. This thread is still a good read for many and may help them avoid jail or ban. It reminiscent of Talamr's brush with vendoring his JC. ;)
 
purefyre said:
heh I miss Muurian and Chamelion back in the day.  This thread is still a good read for many and may help them avoid jail or ban.  It reminiscent of Talamr's brush with vendoring his JC.   ;)
Click to expand...
You bumped a thread from... two years ago?
 
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